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novara, who are they? who are you?

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Picket
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Oct 4 2013 03:48
novara, who are they? who are you?

I'm listening to the novara podcasts and it's very good but I can't get my head round this: who are you? who are you?

snipfool
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Oct 4 2013 08:23

At risk of just stating the obvious... The presenters introduce themselves every episode: Aaron Peters (@aaronjohnpeters) and James Butler (@piercepenniless). I don't know anything else about Novara though, not sure what you mean.

I like the podcasts too though!

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Steven.
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Oct 4 2013 08:24

Do you mean on libcom? They don't really post here. One of them has once or twice under his real name, I don't think the other has at all - they use twitter

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Oct 4 2013 13:48

No I know their names but I can't find anything else about them. Maybe they want anonymity, fair enough, but it seems unusual.

TrotskyLover420
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Oct 4 2013 14:39

red star They're a right bunch of bloody muppets, thats who they are. red star

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Oct 4 2013 15:33

Yeah I did google their names. As you note, Jim, there is a result for Aaron but nothing for James.

I have a more public internet profile, and I'm no-one, I don't do podcasts or nuffink smile

Maybe there's more than I could find last night, I possibly was not in the "right frame of mind" for a thorough web search.

snipfool
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Oct 4 2013 15:42

I might be creating some kinda infinite internet loop by putting this here but... https://twitter.com/aaronjohnpeters/status/386137239555543041

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Picket
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Oct 4 2013 15:48

Haha smile

The mysterious Peters is now being followed, I will have my answers!

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Joseph Kay
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Oct 4 2013 16:52

Aaron Peters is usually topless, James Butler is usually drunk.

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Picket
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Oct 4 2013 16:57

I'm glad my stereotyped imaginings have been proven correct smile

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sabot
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Mar 25 2014 13:47

What the hell happened to Novara?

snipfool
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Mar 25 2014 14:49
sabot wrote:
What the hell happened to Novara?

Do you mean how did their radio show get so boring?

edit: whoops, https libcom doesn't show embedded youtube so i didn't see the vid at first, just your question.

yeah, i echo that! i find their recent coverage uninteresting to say the least.

Spikymike
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May 5 2015 10:27

Ok so although I have read a couple of interesting pieces by James Butler on this site, and commented on one of them, I never got round to following the podcasts which have been linked from time to time and I'm still wondering what the duo's political underpinning is after picking up a friendly (despite the title) but critical reference to novara media here: http://www.worldsocialism.org/spgb/socialist-standard/2010s/2015/no-1329...
The overal approach behind the media project reminded me a bit of the way that 'Plan C' operate but otherwise I'm none the wiser really?

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Joseph Kay
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May 5 2015 12:23

They don't have a manifesto or anything. Listening to the show is probably the best bet, some episodes have focussed more on 'what is to be done?' type questions:

Spikymike
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May 5 2015 17:58

Thanks Joseph - listened to the whole of that and whilst there were some interesting questions and thoughts buried in it I was left wondering what might be the useful conclusion. Referring back to the spgb article I would have to concur with the comment ''....and five minutes of their quickfire patter is enough to make your head spin.'' Not sure I want to become a regular listener to their programme to work out any useful conclusions - Think I prefer the written word to be able to reflect and comment on/ respond to.

wojtek
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May 6 2015 01:21

Dominic Cooper and Andy Jordan? <3 x

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May 6 2015 09:13

http://wire.novaramedia.com/2015/05/4-reasons-working-class-radicals-sho...

sad

Jason Cortez
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May 6 2015 17:22

This sort of captures their positions
http://novaramedia.com/2014/10/voting-elections-do-they-matter/

wojtek
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Oct 8 2016 16:26

Anyone still listen to it?

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fingers malone
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Oct 8 2016 23:49

I do, usually when I'm doing housework

wojtek
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Oct 9 2016 01:07

They should do an audio version of the iww's recomposition series and less material about Labour.

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Oct 9 2016 10:49

I occasionally do but I always found their style to close to political-commentary-as-usual and was not surprised when they went all Labour. I often wonder if the *style* of analysis can be used as an early sign of someones actual politics or if the style of analysis changes ones politics.

I do believe nerding out changes ones thought processes. Political nerdery and current affairs commenting is to much of a ssport with established rules. Eventually people can't see beyond the edge of the pitch and the rules of the game becomes the only reality.

I've seen it before when podcasts/writers become more and more mainstream as the sink deeper into their roles as journalists or commentators.

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Oct 9 2016 19:52
Cooked wrote:
I occasionally do but I always found their style to close to political-commentary-as-usual and was not surprised when they went all Labour. I often wonder if the *style* of analysis can be used as an early sign of someones actual politics or
I do believe nerding out changes ones thought processes. Political nerdery and current affairs commenting is to much of a ssport with established rules. Eventually people can't see beyond the edge of the pitch and the rules of the game becomes the only reality.

I've seen it before when podcasts/writers become more and more mainstream as the sink deeper into their roles as journalists or commentators.

Respectfully, I disagree with your point about bourgeois political nerdery inherently leading to an acceptance of bourgeois politics. I geek out on the stuff, and it's partially because it allows me to be able to, with varying degrees of accuracy, predict what's to come. Of course, many of the ways in which the macro impacts my day to day life doesn't vary much, regardless of what happens in the political sphere, but occassionally it does, and in those cases, it's nice to know what to expect.

Additionally, and more importantly, I've found that being able to speak knowledgeably about mainstream politics with friends and coworkers gives me more credibility when I talk about anti-Politics. Understanding arcane rules and processes allows me to effectively demonstrate how things like re-districting to eliminate gerrymandering, term-limits, campaign finance reform, an increase in proportional representation, or whatever other reform is the latest craze will do absolutely nothing to change the structural role of bourgeois 'democracy," and allows me to demonstrate how we have absolutely no control over the most important aspects of our day-to-day lives.

And while we are all blind to our own weaknesses, I don't believe it's put me on a path to selling out my communist principles. In fact, watching the consistent ineptitude of "progressives" to ever implement even a modicum of positive change, I'd say it actually reinforces the dead-end nature of electoral politics. I'm not disputing you've seen a correlation, but correlation doesn't automatically mean causation, obviously.

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Oct 10 2016 18:51
jesuithitsquad wrote:
Respectfully, I disagree with your point about bourgeois political nerdery inherently leading to an acceptance of bourgeois politics. ...

Additionally, and more importantly, I've found that being able to speak knowledgeably about mainstream politics with friends and coworkers gives me more credibility when I talk about anti-Politics. ...

And while we are all blind to our own weaknesses, I don't believe it's put me on a path to selling out my communist principles.

Well you are on the path just you wait! Soon you'll be getting more and more involved in writing and podcasting. Before you know it you'll have a weekly spot somewhere an then BAM. Vote Hillary! (critically) wink

Joking aside I did mention sinking into a role as a "radical" journalist being a part of the process. And yes knowing teh system is useful in conversations with co workers. I would certainly have use for it. It's endless though... and my patience not there since reading about party politics pisses me off. This is despite having a job quite sensitive to political changes.

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jesuithitsquad
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Oct 11 2016 00:02

smile

Quote:

This is despite having a job quite sensitive to political changes.

that can be very nerve-wrecking. i do not envy you one bit. i've been there before, and hope to never be again!

wojtek
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Mar 15 2017 14:15

If you want to be 'intersectional', you can't only talk about 'whiteness' right?

radicalgraffiti
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Mar 15 2017 18:47
wojtek wrote:
If you want to be 'intersectional', you can't only talk about 'whiteness' right?

this is the first mention of "whiteness" in the thread

wojtek
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Mar 16 2017 06:12

I know. Novara published some stuff about the 'unbearable whiteness' of brexit, but nothing exploring why other communites, eg. south asians also voted leave.
https://www.vice.com/en_uk/article/why-did-south-asians-vote-for-brexit

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Mar 16 2017 08:19

I don't think Asian people voted as a majority for leave though?

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fingers malone
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Mar 16 2017 08:23

From BBC website
"There are numerous wards towards the bottom left of the graph where electorates with lower educational qualifications nevertheless produced low Leave and high Remain votes. This is where the link between low qualifications and Leave voting breaks down.
It turns out that these exceptional wards have high ethnic minority populations, particularly in Birmingham and Haringey in north London.
In contrast, there are virtually no dramatic outliers on the other side of the line, where comparatively highly educated populations voted Leave. Only one point on the graph stands out - this is Osterley and Spring Grove in Hounslow, west London, a mainly ethnic minority ward which had a Leave vote of 63%. While this figure does include some postal votes, they are not nearly enough to explain away this unusual outcome.
In fact, in Ealing and Hounslow, west London boroughs with many voters of Asian origin, the ethnic correlation was in the other direction to the national picture: a higher number of Asian voters was associated with a higher Leave vote."

Ok so it looks like, unsurprisingly, the Asian community holds politically diverse opinions

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Mar 16 2017 10:52

Although fingers, that could just mean not that more Asian people voted Leave, but that more white people in areas with large Asian populations voted Leave.

I don't think that whiteness is the most useful category in terms of analysing Brexit - especially as the people who will be mostly affected are the mostly white EU citizens. However I don't really think it's a big deal as that word was just used to make a catchy headline. And I think a lot of white people get overly sensitive if anyone says anything about white people