Glossary *Read before you post*

Hmmm. I am new round here, so forgive me, but I do have a comment about your glossary. You seem to put communists into two camps - Libertarian and statist.

I think it may be useful to subdivide the statist approach - you state that statist communists want to see the state wither away after a while. That may be true of many people. But what about those "communists" who believe that the state is the ultimate vehicle for communism, supreme and should remain (i.e. Stalinists)??

Just a thought.

'Stalinism's a moot term, from their own point view there is no such thing -they're just Leninists. It was a definition given to them by their enemies, 'Trotskyists' especially (who often prefer being called Leninist) and although there are a few small, boring differences between the two groupings the concept of the withering state wasn't one of them...All State Socialists take the (absurd) view that, yeah sure a stateless society is lovely and that's what communism's about, but the capturing of Political State power by the 'working-class' is necessry in the mean-time. What they're associated with in practice may seem confusing but I asure you they told themselves they were heading for communism.

This cross-eyed self-delusion goes all the way back to Marx.

Whether they want the state to wither away or not is largely irrelevant, since it never can. But didn't Stalin claim to want the state to wither away too?

Of course that is the distinction. Good communist ie Libertarian and Bad ones ie stateist.

What would be the point in spliting the bad communists into two groups.

Also were stalists really communist anyway. (wrong place to post that last bit)

I think they were in that that's what most of them really wanted, just that can't be the outcome of their ideas...

Hi

But is what they wanted worth having? Sell me one benefit of communism, libertarian or otherwise.

Love

LR

That won't work on Lazy Riser.

How bout loads of these?

Hi

Actually, I'm quite poor at the moment, so you may be onto a winner there. What especially communist thing do you recommend I do as way of increasing my level of luxury?

Love

LR

join a credit union, and generally share more

Hi

Hardly "communist", I know Tories and Christians who'd recommend the same course of action.

Love

LR

Yes, communism already exists in our everyday life and benefits everyone. That's what's so great about it 8)

Hi

Christians and Tories? And I thought I was sailing close the wind recruiting currency speculators.

Seriously, Credit Unions are in the tradition of Victorian Philanthropy not working class autonomy.

Love

LR

Sorry but unless you abandon capitalist notions of wealth and luxury then you will be poorer as a result of communism as this country is subsidised by the former empire.

Christianity, following from christ's teachings (which few christians do), is actually fairly redistributive and egalitarian.

No, you're muddling up a series of developments that happened at the same time, including paternalism and working class mutual aid. Who is the 'philanthropist' that is needed for us to form a credit union?

As for recruiting, that's because you're seeing communism as a political movement, rather than an ever-present tendency in human society. Sucker

On the whole, as I get marginally better interest from a credit union and can loan at better rates, while simultaneously enabling others with poor credit ratings to circumvent banks/loan sharks, it seems a good idea to me...

Hi

Yes, yes comrades, please cut me a little slack. I’m more than familiar with the operation of Credit Unions…

The FSA.

http://www.abcul.org/page/about/settingup.cfm

Talk about self management of your own exploitation. Now off my case, if you please.

Love

LR

Stop point out when you're wrong? No thanks, it's too much fun.

How on earth is the FSA a 'victorian philpanthropist'. Because being registered with a statutory body is like getting a hand out from THE MAN!!!???///???1111!!!!!

Hi

Whilst I'm at it...

I seem to have found myself on the wrong side of the barricade. Honestly, this is so appalling I’m totally lost for words. Christianity and Thirdworldism. I've lost the will to live.

Love

LR

Hi

Poetic license, comrade. You're not an ideas man, you're just a pedant. Not really.

Love

LR

Ah. Was it a metaphor, as well?

Bluffer

Not really

What?

Its true that this country is subsidised by others.

Its true that christianity is fairly tolerant if you ignore virtually all christians and the way they act. And of course the concept that he was the son of God.

I suppose you could divide commies into State Communists and State Capitalists?I can't imagine the state "socialising" the working classes without introducing a greta deal of sexism and xenophoboia. I tend to have a problem with society being strictly divided

so I tend to avoid the term "commiunist/sm" except to refer to primitive communism.

Libertarian tends to mean both a lack of state intervention in the economy and in people's private lives, though not necessarily a lack of government/state (but then you go into "American Anarchism i.e ancappery/Robert Novic etc )

Er, just wondering , but why has it been saying 184 posts for the last 20 at least in my profile?

Don't worry Rocinante, no-one else understands what he means either. Anarchoneilist, if you're going to talk gibberish please could you at least not do it on introductory thought? New people could get very confused.