Organise!

Jack:

But there is no Organise-IWA.

I think they should change it to Organize!

as it stands now, most of Organise! now is university educated - I blame the cheapening of degrees personally, they'll let anyone in university these days.

You have quoted several valid reasons for the demise of the IWA Organise. But i would like to ask are there any political reasons why anarchism has been in such a poor state up north in ireland whilst it seems that down south there is a significant growth in the broad anarchist movement and the formal organisations in both number and membership. It appears to me that anarchist ideas seem to have a small but significant resonance now amongst a good layer of activists and some of the population in the south, definitely more tahn at any time in my life.

Perhaps it is worth examining the way the ideas have been promoted, tested and applied to see if lessons can be learned that will benefit the growth of anarchism all over Ireland and further afield.

The growth in anarchism in the south of Ireland yer talking about is really a very recent thing. As for by extension the 'non-growth' of anarchism in the north I'm not sure what you are asking. Just Books was opened by the Belfast Anarchist Collective back in 1978, according to comrades in Glasgow (that claims a longer radical and anarchist tradition of sorts) the recent anarchist bookfair in Belfast was significantly bigger than in that city (and as its a first I'd be pretty positive about that).

To be fair Organise! has grown in recent years, though not at the same rate as the WSM in Dublin and for many many years both organisations had only a handful of members. To be honest though I don't think Organise! have put as much emphasis on recruitment as the WSM.

There is also the difference in political climate, which really is worlds apart and more difficult to operate in, and the tendency for many members of the working class to identify with nationalism or one sort or the other. Anarchists and other anti-sectarian socialists have also faced the potential for getting beaten up, threatened, ostracised etc., because their political outlook didn't fit. Though I'd say now its probably even harder to be 'anti-sectarian' than during the troubles - these days anyone can be sectarian and respect the sectarianism of others - thats the outcome of demands for parity of esteem.

I don't think its possible to say that political lessons could be drawn that, for instance, would lead to a conclusion that the north needs the WSM or that type of approach. I'd be very concerned that the WSM would in actual practice be unable to maintain much in the way of 'cross community' working class membership or support up here.

Also, given the state of the broader workers movement in the north the influence of Organise! has not been insignificant.

All sorta irrelevant though cos janeymac wasn't even asking John. the question and he isn't in Organise! I don't think that his answer could ever be much more than superficial really but then you even bothering to post here is pretty irrelevant as well given the opening of your post - so unless you wanted to discuss it further why'd you even bother?

okidokey

Same to yersel'

Thanks for the reply, I wasn't really refering to just the WSM in the context of the south, there are several anarchist/libertarian initiatives underway there including the Seomra Spraoi, RAG, the CAZ etc. and many campaigns with a significant anarchist presence and influence. I am not seeking to prove any point just seeking answers to apply to organising. The relative growth of anarchism in activists and activity I think is stark.

I accept the climate is different, but people organise politically in all circumstances, how do you exist at all in such a situation? When you say there has been some growth what is your membership now compared to the previous anarchist groups?

I am curious as to the differences in approach that you allude to but don't spell out between yourselves and the WSM, what are they?

Do you meet regularly (how often)? do you pay regular subs? do you produce a regular propaganda newsheet? is there a large turnover in membership or do people stay in for the long haul? does everybody pull their weight? Is there a requirement on members to do an amount of work?

Given what John says above about the gang of three in the WSM (something I am unaware of), have you got a core of hardworking activists capable of expanding the organisation?

Are the people in Organise filled with ambition or just part of a club? Is there a hunger for revolution there or what?

There have also been various collectively ran and anarchist inspired projects in Belfast over the years, from the A Centre in Belfast in the mid 70s (in keeping with the times very punk rock), Belfast Anarchist Collective and Just Books, the early Womens News was a collective, Giros/BYCG (which closed a few years ago), and the Rathcoole Self Help Group had anarchists involved in it as well. Really only Organise! and a re-emerging Just Books now (with a lot of overlap).

As for existing at all its pretty much the case that with the start of the troubles anarchists were pretty much confined to the city centre politically which provided a limited 'neutral' space, some tagged onto republicanism as well though. Although, interestingly, the first version of Organise! emerged in Antrim and Ballymena in the mid-eighties (towns that have a reputation for being predominantly loyalist) - so of course people organise politically in all sorts of circumstances. In fact those looking for an alternative to the then current situation were probably more likely to organise because rather in spite of it, how generalisable that sort of motivation is is unclear to me though.

Membership in comparison to the old BAC is higher, seeing themselves as a collective they didn't want to get beyond a particular size. In terms of other 'versions' of Organise! we are slightly bigger than when 'Organise!' affiliated to the IWA. There are about half a dozen members outside Belfast, most of them pretty isolated and around 10 in Belfast itself. In terms of differences in approach that really refers to differences we have with specific WSM positions. In Belfast we meet once a fortnight, the entire organisation meets once a year at present. We pay regular dues. Our propaganda has for some time been irregular. In terms of turnover, well we do tend to lose members to 'foreign' climes - there are actually only a very small number (less than 5 who I can think of) who have been in Organise! over the years and left who still live in Ireland at all. So retention hasn't been bad and when people come back they have got reinvolved. The amount of weight people pull varies over time depending on peoples personal commitments and thats something I hope the organisation actually remain tolerant of. Yes, members are expected to be involved in the groups meetings and activities though we don't invent campaigns when they don't exist and as we prioritise solidarity with workers in struggle those are the times when we are (all) most involved.

As for hunger for revolution, um, I don't think anyone in Organise! has unrealistic notions about the attainability of a revoution short-term, we are committed to the long haul, that sort of commitment might not be as exciting but we have a number of short-term goals and 'ambitions' that we are working on that we believe we can meet.

Are we capable of expanding the organisation, yes, there is quite a bit of interest at present and we should be able to get a few new members in Belfast out of that over the next month.

aye

...

Yes, just for Organise!

dunno what ye mean by nice, but constructive criticism which is nothing i havnt said in privatly but cause it was a post about Organise thought it was in my personal capacity to post epecially on stuff i dont agree on.

But it's not really constructive criticism if it's simply wrong is it? As Boul demonstrated your assertion that "only two people" do all the work is waaayyyy off the mark. I'll tolerate you being wrong, but tolerance can only go so far!

so there are only two people putting forward ideas and i'm guessing you are one of them.

pure comedy.