wobblies to the factories!

booeyschewy
Posts: 435 Joined: 18-10-06 Location: USA, Miami
Submitted by booeyschewy on 25 December, 2007 - 17:44.

just kidding. I checked the online forums for the first time in forever. Why don't we move en masse to the forums, and use this forum to check in see if new people come and move them yonders. the discussion has gotten so bad, I think it makes sense to have a place for productive discussion amongst comrades.

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Mick Black
Posts: 71 Joined: 03-09-07 Location: Toronto
25 December, 2007 - 19:44

Yeah, I think the iww forums would be a good place to discuss things. At the least we could have "parallel" topics with the ones posted on libcom, so we can discuss things on both the boards.

I checked the iww forums recently, and they're so dead. I think they'll remain so unless there's a concerted effort by libcom wobs to start using them (as far as I know this is the only place wobs use forums).

After we start using them more members of the IWW should start using them as well (hopefully instead of on the email list).

Steven. ""Best hair at Unison conference""
Posts: 1625 Joined: 27-06-06 Location: London
25 December, 2007 - 20:56

well good luck if you want. with discussion forums there's always the danger that if new ones are started two both die on their arse. Also lack of opposing views really kills discussion. it might seem problematic having people like thugarchist on here sometimes, but discussion boards with everyone agreeing on stuff don't last very long!

Mick Black
Posts: 71 Joined: 03-09-07 Location: Toronto
25 December, 2007 - 21:32
John. wrote:
well good luck if you want. with discussion forums there's always the danger that if new ones are started two both die on their arse. Also lack of opposing views really kills discussion. it might seem problematic having people like thugarchist on here sometimes, but discussion boards with everyone agreeing on stuff don't last very long!

I'm sure we'll still find plenty to disagree with and debate within the IWW but yeah using a forum to disucss things internally without the constant flaming and name-calling would be worthwhile.

I don't mind being challenged by outside and opposing views as long as they're comradely and constructive but many libcom posters don't seem to know the meaning of those words.

I also would be amazed if libcom 'dies' if wobs start using the IWW forums, what's going to kill libcom forums is the churlish attitudes that go unchecked here.

booeyschewy
Posts: 435 Joined: 18-10-06 Location: USA, Miami
25 December, 2007 - 23:23

totally. i think we should get all the wobs here on board. wobs are definately not cohesive in our beliefs, and when we yearn for it we can come back here and get harassed.

revol68 "MILF Hunter"
Posts: 17522 Joined: 23-02-04 Location: Belfast
26 December, 2007 - 00:37

yeah I think youse should have a special protected forum where youse can discuss your plans for further class collaboration.

Steven. ""Best hair at Unison conference""
Posts: 1625 Joined: 27-06-06 Location: London
26 December, 2007 - 00:39
Mick Black wrote:
I also would be amazed if libcom 'dies' if wobs start using the IWW forums, what's going to kill libcom forums is the churlish attitudes that go unchecked here.

ha no i just meant the wobbly forum, but it's cool go for it.

any concerns about particular posts can be raised with an admin and we'll do what we can.

EdmontonWobbly "Sombre, jaded class warrior."
Posts: 1313 Joined: 25-03-06 Location: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
26 December, 2007 - 01:18

Instead of what I originally posted I'll just say I have problems with the iww forums because they hate my mac, in fact a little message pops up every time I login saying, 'sorry but our website hates macs' maybe that changed with the update but if I can't login I can't post.

Nate "If Duke had a fanclub I would join it even if that meant I had to quit Chuck's fanclub"
Posts: 1255 Joined: 16-12-05 Location: Minneapolis, US
26 December, 2007 - 01:59

I'd be fine w/ staying here if a wob was given mod privileges and we could vote fucks like Revol off this forum.

revol68 "MILF Hunter"
Posts: 17522 Joined: 23-02-04 Location: Belfast
26 December, 2007 - 02:40
Nate wrote:
I'd be fine w/ staying here if a wob was given mod privileges and we could vote fucks like Revol off this forum.

EdmontonWobbly "Sombre, jaded class warrior."
Posts: 1313 Joined: 25-03-06 Location: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
26 December, 2007 - 03:14

Presumably you are all avoiding interacting with your loved ones like I am so FWIW I'm on a PC right now and can access the IWW forums tonight.

Quote:
I'd be fine w/ staying here if a wob was given mod privileges and we could vote fucks like Revol off this forum.

Nate you know that ain't gonna happen, and frankly it's not fair to ask that of the libcom group. They run their website they can let who they like on. Anyways I really don't care if I'm 'a leftist' according to some. I think my political record speaks for itself and so does yours and if clowns like revol can't see who is actually on their side then it really isn't my problem and frankly shouldn't be yours. Don't sweat the little stuff dude, have another rum and eggnog and I'll buy you a pint in Toronto this spring.

thugarchist "Warning: This poster is recuperating our struggle!!!11"
Posts: 4114 Joined: 26-11-06 Location: Seattle, WA US of A
26 December, 2007 - 03:30
revol68 wrote:
Nate wrote:
I'd be fine w/ staying here if a wob was given mod privileges and we could vote fucks like Revol off this forum.

1. Don't mis-use baseball jokes.
2. Its completely sensible for organizations to have space to discuss things internally.
3. Its also completely sensible for organizations to choose public discussion venues that they can control to a certain extent.

pghwob "Not an apologist for SEIU"
Posts: 684 Joined: 09-12-06 Location: CITIZEN OF INDUSTRY
26 December, 2007 - 05:36

Duke just hit a home run. Must be the 'roids.

syndicalist
Posts: 1270 Joined: 15-04-06
26 December, 2007 - 05:39

Sorry for the non-wobbly intervention.... but.... let's be fair to the libcom admin folks. They were asked by a wobbly to set this up. I suspect if the IWW.org. forums were hot this request might not have been made.

http://libcom.org/forums/feedback-and-content/libcom-wobblies requested by http://libcom.org/user/serge-forward

Obviously there are some real dingos who post stuff on this list, but, as I'm told, this is a public meessage board. But why would wobblies want to post important internal stuff on a public message board anyway?

In spite of the sometimes sheer nonsense of some of the postings or the overdose of wobblyitis postings, I've mainly enjoyed them and have "met" a few more decent souls out there.

x357997 "go ahead, make my day...punk"
Posts: 1852 Joined: 04-12-06 Location: Yay Area
26 December, 2007 - 06:05
Mick Black wrote:
what's going to kill libcom forums is the churlish attitudes that go unchecked here.

not likely. its half the fun.

x357997 "go ahead, make my day...punk"
Posts: 1852 Joined: 04-12-06 Location: Yay Area
26 December, 2007 - 06:05
revol68 wrote:
yeah I think youse should have a special protected forum where youse can discuss your plans for further class collaboration.

oh come now, i know you can do better than that.

Jack "In it for spite"
Posts: 10049 Joined: 22-09-03 Location: Brighton
26 December, 2007 - 10:51

As soon as drupal software upgrades allow it, we're happy to give the forum an IWW moderator - it's a drupal software problem that means we can't. So basically, the fault lies with open source hippies.

Catch will know the timescale for this I reckon. In the meantime remember y'all can just pop a request along to any admin.

fnbrill "Mocking In the Fee World"
Posts: 751 Joined: 13-01-07
26 December, 2007 - 17:37
Jack wrote:
So basically, the fault lies with open source hippies.

Come here Uncle Jack's Banned.

Feighnt "the definition of "nobody important""
Posts: 929 Joined: 20-07-06 Location: canada, nanaimo
27 December, 2007 - 01:50

i'm not a wob, but it makes a lot of sense to revitalize the IWW forum... another reason, aside from the stated ones, is to create an obvious place for newer (or detached) wobs to talk to others.

i mean, really, if a wobbly wanted to talk to others online and didnt already know about a ton of sites out there, where'd they be most likely to pop into - the IWW forum, or (a site they know nothing about) libcom?

Mick Black
Posts: 71 Joined: 03-09-07 Location: Toronto
29 December, 2007 - 22:39

FYI, I just wanted to point wobs to some discussion on this topic on the IWW board at: Let's start using this forum!

There have also been a few other recent posts on the board such as on the upcomming organizing summit

brainstorming for presentations to young workers

One on The history of CAW unionized Starbucks in Canada

I even started a thread for any IWW members in the gardening / landscaping industry (you must be an lWW member and logged into the website to read this one).

catch "unpractical[sic] and blinkered"
Posts: 9938 Joined: 07-02-06 Location: London
30 December, 2007 - 02:08
Jack wrote:
As soon as drupal software upgrades allow it, we're happy to give the forum an IWW moderator - it's a drupal software problem that means we can't. So basically, the fault lies with open source hippies.

Catch will know the timescale for this I reckon. In the meantime remember y'all can just pop a request along to any admin.

At least three months.

Possibly less than six.

syndicalist
Posts: 1270 Joined: 15-04-06
30 December, 2007 - 14:10
Quote:
Mick: even started a thread for any IWW members in the gardening / landscaping industry (you must be an lWW member and logged into the website to read this one).

Just curious, would this be for people who work in the commerical sector? Or the guys pushing mowers for mom/pop home gardening businesses? Or both?

I did that sort of stuff years ago for a mom/pop guy. I was let go 'cause I think I ran over a wee-too many garden hoses with my push lawnmover. Fuckin' teenager, what can I say.

You can PM me if you wish.

Mick Black
Posts: 71 Joined: 03-09-07 Location: Toronto
30 December, 2007 - 18:43
syndicalist wrote:
Quote:
Mick: even started a thread for any IWW members in the gardening / landscaping industry (you must be an lWW member and logged into the website to read this one).

Just curious, would this be for people who work in the commerical sector? Or the guys pushing mowers for mom/pop home gardening businesses? Or both?

I did that sort of stuff years ago for a mom/pop guy. I was let go 'cause I think I ran over a wee-too many garden hoses with my push lawnmover. Fuckin' teenager, what can I say.

You can PM me if you wish.

It would be for both workers in larger companies, public works, and small businesses, or even self-employed workers or co-operatives.

On a tangent, it surprises me to hear small-scale capitalists euphemistically called "a mom and pop business” by a syndicalist. Surely you know that the exploitation of workers in small shops is no less severe than the exploitation by large companies, in many cases it's even worse!

syndicalist
Posts: 1270 Joined: 15-04-06
31 December, 2007 - 03:11

Mick:

Quote:
it surprises me to hear small-scale capitalists euphemistically called "a mom and pop business” by a syndicalist. Surely you know that the exploitation of workers in small shops is no less severe than the exploitation by large companies, in many cases it's even worse!

I was only trying to differentiate between size of employers. It was not a commentary of the level of exploitation.

Mick Black
Posts: 71 Joined: 03-09-07 Location: Toronto
31 December, 2007 - 14:38
syndicalist wrote:
Mick:

Quote:
it surprises me to hear small-scale capitalists euphemistically called "a mom and pop business” by a syndicalist. Surely you know that the exploitation of workers in small shops is no less severe than the exploitation by large companies, in many cases it's even worse!

I was only trying to differentiate between size of employers. It was not a commentary of the level of exploitation.

Fair enough, no harm done, but the term "mom and pop business" is commonly used in most contexts to describe a "friendly" family bussiness that's not as "bad" as big corporations. It's a pet-peeve of mine as working for a family business has a lot of added stress as the owners bring their family's drama into the workplace as well and often being smaller employers try and screw you over the smallest things. Like I said it's a euphemism that I think we could do without.

Mick Black
Posts: 71 Joined: 03-09-07 Location: Toronto
31 December, 2007 - 14:44

Sorry for the thread drift there...

Just an FYI that there now is a draft proposal on Reforming the General Assembly up now. It's an "all members" post so you have to have an IWW account and be logged in and subscribed to the "all members" group to read it.

If you don't have an iww.org account, and are an IWW member in good standing, you can register for one at: http://www.iww.org/en/user/register

If you already have an iww.org account but aren't on the "All members" group then, assuming you're an IWW member, you can go to http://www.iww.org/en/og and subscribe to it.

Nate "If Duke had a fanclub I would join it even if that meant I had to quit Chuck's fanclub"
Posts: 1255 Joined: 16-12-05 Location: Minneapolis, US
2 January, 2008 - 02:46

Thanks Mick.

Stripey "Intersectionalist workers of the world"
Posts: 269 Joined: 30-10-03 Location: Ottawa, Canada
2 January, 2008 - 06:07

Hey JC brought up a good point, I dunno what to think about it though.

Mick Black
Posts: 71 Joined: 03-09-07 Location: Toronto
4 January, 2008 - 19:39

It's still pretty slow on the IWW board but there's a few new topics there for wobs to discuss. If you get bored of the name-calling and strawman arguements here...

Canadian Labour Law thread

General Organization Bulletin 2007 - #9 (PDF) IWW members only

and in the better late than never catagory the IWW Harassment Policy is now posted in the year-old thread about it.

Steven. ""Best hair at Unison conference""
Posts: 1625 Joined: 27-06-06 Location: London
4 January, 2008 - 23:13
Mick Black wrote:
It's still pretty slow on the IWW board but there's a few new topics there for wobs to discuss. If you get bored of the name-calling and strawman arguements here...

Dude, you can't pretend the wobblies here are immune from that - they're as guilty as anyone else.

Mick Black
Posts: 71 Joined: 03-09-07 Location: Toronto
4 January, 2008 - 23:35
John. wrote:
Mick Black wrote:
It's still pretty slow on the IWW board but there's a few new topics there for wobs to discuss. If you get bored of the name-calling and strawman arguements here...

Dude, you can't pretend the wobblies here are immune from that - they're as guilty as anyone else.

Sure some wobs have stooped to the lowest common demoninator on this board, most however haven't just as most posters on libcom haven't.

The problem as I see it is that there's a minority of people who post a lot of uncomradely garbage that brings libcom's board down to an level that actually discourages serious discussion of the various topics. It's a sad thing to see.

I don't really have any interest in trying to change the nature of this board (that's up to libcom members like yourself) so instead I'm advocating that wobbiles start using the iww.org forums.

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