breastfeeding on C4
Feb 1 2006 22:10
A long shot, I know, but did anyone just see that programme on c4 about breastfeeding? It was fucking cool.
Basically they were following women who were breastfeeding "older" children (i think the ages ranged from 2 to 7), and talking about their experiences. Britain has one of the lowest rates of breastfeeding in the world, and if kids are breastfeed they're mostly weaned really quickly.
Loads of the mothers got shit from people for breastfeeding in public, the best quote being some guy who said "I don't think it should be allowed. There's a lot of perverts around, and you know paedophidlia is a really weird thing", as if the mothers were somehow putting their kids at risk.
I couldn't help feeling a bit weird about seeing a 7 year old on the breast, but I'm not sure why.
Also they showed some mothers having a "nurse-in" in response to a woman being nicked for breastfeeding in a park, which was pretty cool. I think similar stuff happens in America, nurse-ins in Starbucks to protest their policy of exiles breastfeeding mothers to the toilets (cos you know, breastfeeding is akin to having a shit, right?).
*waits for thread to fall to the bottom of page, or stream of hilarious tit jokes...*
Feb 1 2006 22:19
#2
Woah! 
Why is it disgusting?
Feb 1 2006 22:22
#3
zobag wrote:
Woah!Why is it disgusting?
Cos a seven year old doesn't need breast feed and more to the point it's likely to make the kid clingy.
I'm sorry don't you find anything weird about a seven year old sucking on their ma's tit?
Feb 1 2006 22:30
#4
Uh... yes, that's why I said so in my post you big fool. Just because I find it weird doesn't mean there's a justifiable reason for ti being disgusting though. I try not to let knee-jerk reactionary socialised judgements be the extent of my opinions... 
Like I said, I do find it weird, but on the other hand the average age for weaning globally is 4, and I'll bet you'd find a four-year old breastfeeding weird too. it's just not what we're used to.
I agree with the clingy/dependancy thing, but I'm not sure it's necesarily true.
edit - you're so hysterical revol 
Feb 1 2006 22:40
#5
I know i'm reacting strongly but i could just imagine it, it would be like when you were made to split one can of coke between you and your brother, only worse.
"I want a can of coke"
"you've no need of coke, come here and suck on my tit!"
I wouldn't be that shocked at a four year old breast feeding to be honest, but I would wonder as to why the woman could be arsed with sore, chaffed nipples and the inconveniance?
Feb 1 2006 23:25
#6
None of the kids were soley breast-fed though, just occasionally.
Feb 1 2006 23:47
#7
Hi
Quote:
I couldn't help feeling a bit weird about seeing a 7 year old on the breast, but I'm not sure why.
Because evolutionary psychology is wonderful. As are you.
Love
LR
Feb 2 2006 00:09
#8
zobag wrote:
None of the kids were soley breast-fed though, just occasionally.
Like a treat? That makes it a little more disturbing.
I thought (may be wrong) that the benefits of milk, unless there is no safe drinking water, are only for the first two years max.
Feb 2 2006 10:33
#9
The bit I saw on richard and judy looked quite interesting. They were saying that they reckon its benificial to the child. They showed a clip of the girl getting upset because she couldn't suckle anymore. It did seem a bit strange, but they were saying it happens all the time in other parts of the world.
Feb 2 2006 11:20
#10
Jef Costello wrote:
zobag wrote:
None of the kids were soley breast-fed though, just occasionally.Like a treat? That makes it a little more disturbing.
I thought (may be wrong) that the benefits of milk, unless there is no safe drinking water, are only for the first two years max.
I seem to remember that's the case.
Also, as the mother of my daughter put it yesterday, - "when your child grows teeth, that's a bit of a message, isn't it?"
Feb 2 2006 11:44
#11
Jef - I don't think it ever stops being beneficial from a health/nutrition point of view.
Feb 2 2006 12:10
#12
The national health is on a big push towards breastfeeding at the moment, in comparision to a year ago there's now shitloads of stuff on the maternity wards about BF, at brighton general.
Once again the sensational media strikes, lets find the more extreme case of BF, to sell ads an spice it up.
When the reality is it's good for both baby's an mothers to feed. But we'll ignore that for spiceyness. Hey follow Jordan according to her breastfeeding is disgusting, maybe she's jealous though...
Feb 2 2006 12:29
#13
Lol, yeah breastfeeding is disgusting but pumping your tits full of litres of sillicone is... lovely? Weird priorities people have 
yeah that prog was quite sensationalist from that point of view, having some pair of home schooled 7 year olds breastfeeding is going to give it a pretty bad rap for most people I guess, but then they did have a more "normal" woman who was breastfeeding her 2 year old and was actively involved in promoting breastfeeding, so that was pretty cool.
Feb 2 2006 12:42
#14
"Normal" woman was going on about promoting bf to one an all, an saying it wasn't just middle class women and nutty hippies who bf and that was what she was trying to get across, and then what did the program show, nutty hippie woman. Sensational!!! What more can you expect.
Feb 2 2006 12:57
#15
i think the reason at least partly for why is yuk for a seven yr old to be breastfeeding is related to the developing sexuality of a child as it grows older . its kind of odd when you realise that there can be sexual feelings for the mother in breast feeding also and you have to mentally interpret those feelings in a different way. i'd also wonder why the mother of the seven year old wishes so strongly to continue to nurture her child in a socially unacceptable way when the child is quite capable of getting nutrition elsewhere. whose dependent on who? there are physical and emotional boundaries and barriers which develop between parents and children and the intense relationship you have with tiny babies changes over time and i think its important that that happens so a child can mature and become its own person. i wonder if prolonging the years of breastfeeding past the toddler stage has an effect on that process?
Feb 2 2006 13:33
#16
Hi lucy82
Definitely. The co-dependence point is characteristically insightful.
I reckon natural selection is to blame for the reason we may find it “inexplicably” yucky…
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolutionary_psychology
Incest avoidance mechanisms, say no more. I expect an anti-Utilitarian flame or two now.
Love
LR
Feb 2 2006 17:56
#17
zobag wrote:
Lol, yeah breastfeeding is disgusting but pumping your tits full of litres of sillicone is...
rather deceptive to a hungry child?
I thought in terms of antigens and things that the child needed up until a certain point breastfeeding was beneficial, after that it was equivalent. I think Lucy's point about co-dependence is well made. I saw a programme a while back with a similar situation and the woman had a real preoccupation with her declining fertility and it seemed far more about infantilising the child and maintaining herself in a certain position of motherhood.
Quote:
"when your child grows teeth, that's a bit of a message, isn't it?"
Feb 2 2006 18:52
#18
lucy82 wrote:
i think the reason at least partly for why is yuk for a seven yr old to be breastfeeding is related to the developing sexuality of a child as it grows older .
To be honest, I'm not sure that's quite correct. Sexuality doesn't just slowly develop as a child gets older. In developmental psychology, esp. psychoanalysis, they seem to have the belief that a young baby is actually quite a sexual being - anal, genital stage, and all that stuff - which then gets repressed until the earlier teens for girls, and a bit later for boys when puberty kicks in ... So there's kind of a short asexual period in between I guess from about 4/5 to 11/12 ...
Feb 2 2006 18:58
#19
Anyone familar with Wilhelm Reich 
Anyway Im not but surely when the prog talked to the Spanish lady and she was surprised at British attitudes, it got me thinking sexual repression might have a little bit of effect on the idea of breast feeding. The trippy neo-pagan in the prog said something similar, but I dont thank the Sun Goddess before lunch, so you can at least take my comments seriously.
Feb 2 2006 19:04
#20
Hi
I feel a Brinton moment coming on.
Love
LR
Feb 2 2006 19:14
#21
Quote:
In developmental psychology, esp. psychoanalysis, they seem to have the belief that a young baby is actually quite a sexual being - anal, genital stage, and all that stuff -
but maybe the difference is when they become aware that they are. i'm not sure that there is ever a period
Quote:
from about 4/5 to 11/12 ...
where a person is asexual expecially perhaps in this culture. don't know really, just musing aloud...
Feb 2 2006 21:34
#22
Tomson95 wrote:
lucy82 wrote:
i think the reason at least partly for why is yuk for a seven yr old to be breastfeeding is related to the developing sexuality of a child as it grows older .To be honest, I'm not sure that's quite correct. Sexuality doesn't just slowly develop as a child gets older. In developmental psychology, esp. psychoanalysis, they seem to have the belief that a young baby is actually quite a sexual being - anal, genital stage, and all that stuff - which then gets repressed until the earlier teens for girls, and a bit later for boys when puberty kicks in ... So there's kind of a short asexual period in between I guess from about 4/5 to 11/12 ...
I think that is using a definition of sexual desire that is farwider than people would generally use.
Young children often stimulate themselves genitally, but it isn't masturbation.
It's very hard to examine this without looking at societal pressures, but I don't know of any societies where it is common to breastfeed for that long, that may be cultural but it is still uniform as far as I know.
I think the British are more repressed about breastfeeding. I know its natural but I never really know where to look 
You don't want to stare, but you don't want to offend by avoiding looking, so I end up staring at anything else.
I don't think that there is an asexual stag but I think the desire for sexual activity develops later on, during puberty. Although it does seem that we live in a society that simultaneously abhors paedophilia and sexualises young children. I don't know how the hell I'll raise children without them picking up the warped views of sexuality that this society promotes.
Feb 2 2006 22:10
#23
Quote:
I think the British are more repressed about breastfeeding. I know its natural but I never really know where to look
i think the issue about public breastfeeding could be solved with a little give and take. breastfeeding a kid can be done discreetly (well, if the kids not seven yrs old anyway 
) and it should be done discreetly because whether people like it or not boobs are sexual objects and it embarasses other people if you just heave them out in public. crazy when they are all over mainstream newspapers but thats the way it is and i wouldn't want to deliberately make people uncomfortable cause i'm nice basically. i don't think though that women should be banished to the toilet to breastfeed, thats going to far the other way. it annoys me that that does happen. all it needs is a discreetly placed scarf and a degree of understanding on both sides. see, i am secreatly an on the fence liberal.
Quote:
I don't know how the hell I'll raise children without them picking up the warped views of sexuality that this society promotes.
by talking with them about those views of sexuality and being honest with them. it seems to have worked ok for me. they have to live in the real world along with the rest of us flawed people after all.
Feb 3 2006 12:04
#24
lucy82 wrote:
breastfeeding a kid can be done discreetly
The thing is, how many women have you known/know that aren't discrete when they bf?
cos it's fucking disgusting!
jesus h christ the idea of sucking on my ma's tit when i was 7 is fucked!
Seriously breast feedin I have no problem with, breast feeding a fucking 7 year old in public is just fucked up! it;s fucked up in private as well to be honest!
I mean are you that fucking tight you can't buy your 7 year old a fucking five alive!