Mystical Anarchist Bollox
May 9 2007
As part of a network working towards a co-op cafe I have to work with people whose politics I dont fully accept. This afternoon I had to put up with the usual baits from a self styled mystical anarchist. Two issues of contention were that I wouldnt accept that mystical ideas had something generally to offer (ie the power of crystals amoungst others 
). I was told that crystals were scientifically proven to work, and that pythagoras was a mystic and I was too 'theorical' for criticising anything which fell outside the realms of rationality 
. I counted this by stating that if they were scientifically proven, then ergo they are not mystical but rational and that pythagoras wasnt mystical but culturally different and anti theologian. (I was probably slightly wrong on the later point)
Another point was when we started to remisicent about recent events somebody mentioned a previous encounter with a homeless guy we squatted with who started stealing from activists. I criticised this since we were helping the guy and he chose to snub this. Apparently because I criticised this homeless person, Im no longer an anarchist 
because to question poor people robbing other people is simply not on...what f**king liberal rubbish
May 9 2007
#2
thugarchist wrote:
Its your own fault for talking to these people.
Seconded
May 9 2007
#3
Hey that is a bit harsh guys! OL's point is that you do, in life, have to work with peeps whose views you disagree with. Refusing to talk to them is not an option unless you choose to volunteer in a monastery or summat...
I think the best tactic is to agree to disagree and not get drawn into an argument...it won't benefit anyone and will only end up winding you up..which it has done...
Love
LW X
May 9 2007
#4
Lone Wolf wrote:
Hey that is a bit harsh guys! OL's point is that you do, in life, have to work with peeps whose views you disagree with. Refusing to talk to them is not an option unless you choose to volunteer in a monastery or summat...I think the best tactic is to agree to disagree and not get drawn into an argument...it won't benefit anyone and will only end up winding you up..which it has done...
Love
LW X
I try not to be involved in political action, which this is some form of, with total lunatics. I'm not saying other people should do the same or not, but... if you're working with rock worshippers then you're bound to have some conversations about rock worship.
May 9 2007
#5
t
I guess i was making more of a general point about eg work colleagues as well - just think it is worth saving your arguments only for those who will listen to them... and i am sure you would agree....
Besides i think you are being a bit dismissive here towards the rock worshippers... altogether now.. ohhhhhmmmmm...
Love
LW X
May 9 2007
#6
thugarchist wrote:
Its your own fault for talking to these people.
As Lone wolf states, I think there are occasions when good sincere/inexperienced people work around or with these people. The issue I have is that as a rational militant of the w/c I dont feel right abondoning meetings to irrantional rubbish when the rest of the people involved have potential to do constructive work in the community. I feel honestly bitter that I have to question whether its worthwhile me being involved at all because of the ridiculousness of one persons politics, the options as I see them are retreat, thereby giving me some sanity but abondoning this person to ruling the roost, or including myself and having the chance to influence others but having to sit through turgid rubbish about f**king crystals
May 9 2007
#7
OL
Ah ok so it is one dominant person - a lot here depends on the attitude of the rest of the group to the attempt to dominate ..if they appear to like being whipped by someone with some kinda axe to grind... or at least be too chicken to challenge the behaviour! then they may not be the right peeps for you to be working with..
This is a shame cos the co-op cafe sounds like a good idea... Your other option is - again without being drawn into arguments about the merits or others of our crystalline companions! - to point out that the meeting needs to run to time and that the crystals thing should be post-meeting chat ..which it should be seeing as this is about forming a cafe not a New Age shop...
Love
LW X
May 9 2007
#8
If you are setting up a co-op cafe what do you expect. Nah, just kidding.
May 9 2007
#9
october_lost wrote:
thugarchist wrote:
Its your own fault for talking to these people.As Lone wolf states, I think there are occasions when good sincere/inexperienced people work around or with these people. The issue I have is that as a rational militant of the w/c I dont feel right abondoning meetings to irrantional rubbish when the rest of the people involved have potential to do constructive work in the community. I feel honestly bitter that I have to question whether its worthwhile me being involved at all because of the ridiculousness of one persons politics, the options as I see them are retreat, thereby giving me some sanity but abondoning this person to ruling the roost, or including myself and having the chance to influence others but having to sit through turgid rubbish about f**king crystals
You should boil him, chop off his head and keep it in your fridge.
May 9 2007
#10
i thought pythagoras was actually a mystic, though? i mean, yeah, the math, but he had odd mystical concepts associated to it, and had followers who believed similarly. or am i wrong?
May 9 2007
#11
Feighnt wrote:
i thought pythagoras was actually a mystic, though? i mean, yeah, the math, but he had odd mystical concepts associated to it, and had followers who believed similarly. or am i wrong?
Yeah, but he's remembered for his mathematical genius, rather than his weirdo beliefs, for a reason.
May 9 2007
#12
Most of early mathematical development was done in relation to mystical beliefs. Big deal.
May 9 2007
#13
Why do you want to set up a co-op cafe?
I have to talk to people with mystical beliefs at work, so will put up with that. If it's some hippy anarchist fuck there's no way I'd have anything to do with him out of free choice, fuck im.
May 9 2007
#14
re; thugarchist - at that stage in history they had f-all else to work with!
May 9 2007
#15
streathamite wrote:
re; thugarchist - at that stage in history they had f-all else to work with!
That was my point. I'm sure whoever invented the wheel had some nutty spiritual beliefs too. Doesn't mean the wheel isn't good and it doesn't mean we should all take up cave painting.
May 9 2007
#16
wasn't it pythagoras who believed that beans were evil, and eventually he was killed by an angry mob carrying beans who drove him off a cliff because he'd rather jump off a cliff than touch beans? or was that a dream i had...
May 9 2007
#17
ironically, he fell exactly 3.14159 metres to his death.
actually i think you just have weird dreams 
May 9 2007
#18
Beans are evil.
May 9 2007
#19
Apologies, it was the first thing that came to mind...
May 9 2007
#20
Quote:
wasn't it pythagoras who believed that beans were evil
No. Pythagoras believed in re-incarnation -- you could come back as another person, an animal or a bean. For some reason. This is why he & his followers didn't eat beans.
May 9 2007
#21
It was because he thought beans look a bit like foetuses.
May 9 2007
#22
He should have stuck with the triangles, tbh.
May 9 2007
#23
Quote:
OL's point is that you do, in life, have to work with peeps whose views you disagree with.
Only if you're weak.
May 9 2007
#24
guydebordisdead wrote:
If you are setting up a co-op cafe what do you expect. Nah, just kidding.
na you're right, in my experience those places are exactly the kind of places where you come across hippy mystical shite!
May 9 2007
#25
Quote:
Why do you want to set up a co-op cafe?
We have three people who are long term unemployed and wanted to setup a co-operative as means of generating extra income and an output for their politics. I decided I would support this on the grounds we dont have a scene or any desirably social space for meetings etc. The business itself is workable just not some of the people who decide to help out.
Ive decided I should just call it a day, and concentrate my efforts on other things.
May 9 2007
#26
xConorx wrote:
guydebordisdead wrote:
If you are setting up a co-op cafe what do you expect. Nah, just kidding.na you're right, in my experience those places are exactly the kind of places where you come across hippy mystical shite!
coffeeshops in general attract hare brained muppets, well them and attractive middle class girls, with a sizable amount of overlap.
May 9 2007
#27
I sent this to a few of the people involved
Following on from last night Ive decided I no longer want to participate in any formal project involving X. I felt there were and have been clear breachs in moral and ethical behaviour and rather than submit myself to that ordeal in the future I will simply practice my right of free-association and simply opt out of working towards the co-op and any other projects she's involved in. I havent taken this decision lightly and its regretable, but I can hopefully channel my constructive energies towards something else.
Any constructive comments?
May 9 2007
#28
Joseph K. wrote:
ironically, he fell exactly 3.14159 metres to his death.actually i think you just have weird dreams
Given that pi goes on infinitely (probably) surely he'd still be falling now?
Is this why I didn't get that physics degree?
May 9 2007
#29
Lazy Riser wrote:
Quote:
OL's point is that you do, in life, have to work with peeps whose views you disagree with.Only if you're weak.
But Lazy everyone disagrees with your views! and you with theirs!! Does this mean you are for ever doomed to work alone??? And does this mean that you are strong.. or, like, really, really strange..... Discuss.
Love
LW X
PS Good call i should think OL - sounds like you have had enough of the flakiness...
PPS - Just read your note - pretty cool and sums up your feelings well - nice one. 
May 9 2007
#30
tigersiskillers wrote:
Joseph K. wrote:
ironically, he fell exactly 3.14159 metres to his death.actually i think you just have weird dreams
Given that pi goes on infinitely (probably) surely he'd still be falling now?
Is this why I didn't get that physics degree?
Sure pi is "relative to the position of the observer" and "subject to inelluctable historicity" so it may or may not go on infinitely, or it may actually equal 17.
Its your own fault for talking to these people.