odd split
Feb 6 2007 10:08
...
Feb 5 2007 13:56
#2
yes, what is needed is leftie activist superheroes to parachute in and lead the struggle with d-locks and lock-on tubes, those pesky trade-union consciousness workers will thank us one day! 
Feb 5 2007 14:13
#3
Quote:
when you say the rest of us can offer solidarity,what do you mean,because at the moment it seems to me to mean,that you are supporting the workers in lamenting the loss of their jobs,and mourning with them over their piss poor pay offs,whilst the boss strips the factory of its assets.whats wrong with a bit of agitation,it only takes one person to stop a lorry.when has passive action won anything,jesus you'll be telling me next that the weak will inherit the earth.
You know pal, you're right! Why don't we just take up arms! There'd be no stopping us. Just one AK 47 would have done the trick!
You're a fantasist odd. Look at what is actually achievable here please. The workers want a decent redundancy package, and they want other workers not to have to go through the same shit as they have. It's an odd situation and it's a bit contradictory as the plant itself was profitable and nobody wants to be unemployed. However in the absence of a huge mass of people (like at Upper Clyde) or a near revolutionary situation the idea that they could self-manage production is very far-fetched.
For now the struggle continues but the idea that anyone there is up for some kind of anarchist insurrection is absolutely mental and shows you to be some daft wee kiddy. I can only presume you have a great deal of difficulty in talking to people or you don't get out much - the kind of activity that you're suggesting would not be supported by anyone but a few isolated revolutionaries, and would land you a long time in jail, and no mates.
As it happens they tried to stop the lorries - there was an hour long standoff - but they didn't have enough bodies there to succeed.
Now either stop fucking up this thread with offensive, random, loony insurrectionist comments or just stop posting please as some of us would like to keep this discussion practical and we might even want some of the workers themselves at some point to contribute to it somehow (which they'd never do with shite like "it only takes one person to stop a lorry.when has passive action won anything" being posted; I'm also begining to wonder why I'm tolerating it so much as well to be honest).
Feb 5 2007 16:01
#4
people are losing their jobs and john wants them to answer his 45 questions,whilst the asset stripping goes on.typical pacifist shite.
Feb 5 2007 16:47
#5
odd wrote:
people are losing their jobs and john wants them to answer his 45 questions,whilst the asset stripping goes on.typical pacifist shite.
Er, but I'm not a pacifist. Why don't you get your gun out and fuck off over there then, seems like you're much nearer than me.
And you can stop your false accusations at people, or you can get lost.
Feb 5 2007 18:09
#6
i've never mentioned a gun,its you lot thats mentioned them,and superheroes,all because i questioned the the idea of showing solidarity by standing by,and in my mind doing nothing more than making up the numbers.I was there on friday morning,and after talking to people there saw that there was no mileage to be gained,from people to frightened,to stand up for themselves.they wanted the unions and the msp's to stand up for them.i left when the ssp and solidarity lot turned up,professing help,when all the time sniping at each other in their search for votes come may.i wish the workers all the best,but when the boss strips the assets in front of them,while they stand by,i do not believe they will get what they want.I do not judge the workers who did not want to take matters further than a blockade,however you lot who profess to know better,sicken me with your slopey shoulders support.
Feb 5 2007 18:42
#7
Quote:
i've never mentioned a gun,its you lot thats mentioned them,and superheroes
how else are that number of people going to fight off the police and stop some lorries without a gun or a superhero?
Quote:
there was no mileage to be gained,from people to frightened,to stand up for themselves
so people who have occupied then blockaded a factory are 'too frightened to stand up for themselves?' you're obviously completely unwilling or unable to engage with workers' struggle in the real world, even the most militant workers are too tame for you. confidence will increase when people feel that solidarity will come, that's why it's so important to support glimmers of hope like this, so that next time people know that they won't be alone, and will hopefully be able to take things even further.
or we could just decide that everyone is shit and smugly wait for some insurrection to appear out of nothing....
Feb 5 2007 23:30
#8
magnifico wrote:
Quote:
there was no mileage to be gained,from people to frightened,to stand up for themselvesso people who have occupied then blockaded a factory are 'too frightened to stand up for themselves?' you're obviously completely unwilling or unable to engage with workers' struggle in the real world
It's obvious that odd doesn't have a job or any connection with the real world, just wants to slag off people for not being wadical enough for him. I hope he enjoys the wevolution on his own.
Feb 6 2007 09:11
#9
fucking pacifists,it must be nice and safe to fall back on the same lame line of excuses time after time.
Feb 6 2007 09:23
#10
odd wrote:
fucking pacifists,it must be nice and safe to fall back on the same lame line of excuses time after time.
what are you on about 'pacifists'? :?
who here is advocating pacifism, or passivism? you've written off the workers as scared pacifists already, and if you were actually down there and you came across anything like you are now, i don't blame them for ignoring you, you just sound like macho bluster not a compelling case for more militant action - you could for example have offered to do a lock-on blockade so the workers don't get arrested, like when activists helped out (with workers' consent/co-ordination) in the brighton bin strike/occupation. you can work with the world as it is, or you can dismiss reality in favour of the comfort of your own arsehole, knowing that you are the purest militant and everyone else is a pacifist sheep
when you say the rest of us can offer solidarity,what do you mean,because at the moment it seems to me to mean,that you are supporting the workers in lamenting the loss of their jobs,and mourning with them over their piss poor pay offs,whilst the boss strips the factory of its assets.whats wrong with a bit of agitation,it only takes one person to stop a lorry.when has passive action won anything,jesus you'll be telling me next that the weak will inherit the earth.