Call for execution of teacher in Sudan
Nov 30 2007 12:50
[url=http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/7120263.stm] Story here
This doesn't seem to be completely up-to date-, however, as Sky news has just come out with "Breaking News" that there are thousands gathered with 'sticks and knives' calling for Gillian Gibbons to be put in front of the firing squad
Nov 30 2007 13:01
#2
aw what the FUCK! 
Dec 2 2007 03:20
#3
The Sudanese government taking this action purely to score a political point using this teacher as a pawn knowing full well no offence was intended? Yes
The right using this as political capital in order to discredit Muslims? Yes again.
Liked the sound of the son saying he did not want this to to lead to muslims being pilloried. Bit late but.. nice guy.
Didn't believe the Downing Street spokesman who talked of "various intense activity" it would not be "helpful" to reveal. 
Their only intense activity is to protect themselves not protect their citizens. !
Love
LW XX
PS Absolutely heartbreaking the 7 year old who suggested the name for the bear coming forward and saying "This is all my fault. " How readily the innocent apologise in the face of hatred from the guilty.
Dec 2 2007 03:56
#4
Her lawyer was on npr last night. He said its no big deal. They take to the streets calling for executions all time over anything.
Dec 2 2007 04:05
#5
Sounds like a really jolly place to live. 
Dec 2 2007 10:35
#6
Quote:
The right using this as political capital in order to discredit Muslims?
No doubt, but it looks as if some Muslims don't need any help from the right to descredit themselves. Calling for somebody to be executed just for calling a teddy Mohammed! At the very least these Mad Mullahs and their crazed followers could do with a good PR firm. But I agree every time this sort of thing happens (and it seems to happen every month) it's more votes for the BNP. But while the "left" discuss, as here in other threads, how to deal with the threat from the BNP (such as it is) nobody seems interested in discussing how to deal with the threat (much more real, I'd have thought) from these Islamist extremists -- imagine what would happen to us if they got power here: forced to wear a veil or grow a beard or just simply stoned. Wouldn't be politically correct, I suppose.
Dec 2 2007 10:48
#7
Quote:
The right using this as political capital in order to discredit Muslims? Yes again.
Apologist bullshit, islamist cunts decredit themselves.
The joke is if this was some BNP supporters on the streets of England demanding an immigrant be executed for 'insulting the british nation' or some such shit no one would be going out of the way to worry about the descreditting of white racists. Of course we don't hold these 'other peoples' to the same standards as us, they are like children.
Dec 2 2007 10:49
#8
capricorn wrote:
But while the "left" discuss, as here in other threads, how to deal with the threat from the BNP (such as it is) nobody seems interested in discussing how to deal with the threat (much more real, I'd have thought) from these Islamist extremists -- imagine what would happen to us if they got power here: forced to wear a veil or grow a beard or just simply stoned.
I think that if we are talking about the right using events like this to attack 'Muslims', we should realise that it is not only the BNP. In fact the BNP is only a fringe of the campaign, and its centre is in newspapers such as the Express, and the Mail.
I don't know where you live Capricorn, but I imagine that it is a country where Islamicists have no chance of coming to power. To me this 'what if...' sounds similar to the tone of the scaremongering coming from the right wing press. Do you really think that the UK, or the USA, wherever you live is going to have an Islamic take over?
Devrim
Dec 2 2007 10:54
#9
Devrim wrote:
capricorn wrote:
But while the "left" discuss, as here in other threads, how to deal with the threat from the BNP (such as it is) nobody seems interested in discussing how to deal with the threat (much more real, I'd have thought) from these Islamist extremists -- imagine what would happen to us if they got power here: forced to wear a veil or grow a beard or just simply stoned.I think that if we are talking about the right using events like this to attack 'Muslims', we should realise that it is not only the BNP. In fact the BNP is only a fringe of the campaign, and its centre is in newspapers such as the Express, and the Mail.
I don't know where you live Capricorn, but I imagine that it is a country where Islamicists have no chance of coming to power. To me this 'what if...' sounds similar to the tone of the scaremongering coming from the right wing press. Do you really think that the UK, or the USA, wherever you live is going to have an Islamic take over?
Devrim
they've no chance of coming to power in the UK but they are making further inroads within the muslim community and the liberal left has curtsied to the mad mullahs and their fellow travellers in the name of 'multi culturalsim', their hypocrisy stinks to fuck, they'll be eady to qualify or act as apoligists for anything done by someone with brown skin whilst denouncing white working class people at the first chance they've got.
Dec 2 2007 11:23
#10
I personally stand in solidarity with the would -be executioners. Do we need any more evidence that these people are our brothers and sisters in the class struggle than the fact that they are opposed by the imperialist USA?
Sure the post modernist anarchyist establishment would have you believe that these people are reactionary religious fanatics but what they fail to understand is these people are primarily poor and poor people never do anything wrong.
Dec 2 2007 11:48
#11
Devrim
My point entirely!! The reason I said right and not farright is because i had the likes of the Mail and Express in mind.
Revol
Agree with you too about the left not calling out the "mad mullahs" - i dislike this form of political correctness which is basically rank craven behaviour; cowardice by another name. So both points are true. i don't think anyone on here wouldn't want to call out the genuine nutters but it is the implication that others are being lumped under the same umbrella that is offensive.
Also yeah poor people can be offensive and violent and have offensive views - of course they can! But would this apply to all the poor people of Sudan etc...i doubt it...but is the bonkers ones who are getting the publicity. Admittedly it would be hard to elicit the views of the nonbonkers ones as they too could prolly be stoned or something for daring to criticise. Or at least not go along wih the madness.
Love
LW XX
Dec 2 2007 11:52
#12
revol wrote:
they've no chance of coming to power in the UK but they are making further inroads within the muslim community and the liberal left has curtsied to the mad mullahs and their fellow travellers in the name of 'multi culturalsim', their hypocrisy stinks to fuck, they'll be eady to qualify or act as apoligists for anything done by someone with brown skin whilst denouncing white working class people at the first chance they've got.
I am not at all suggesting any alliances with imams. I am just saying that we have to be careful to avoid the tone of the right, which you can clearly hear the echoes of in the writings of some anarchists on Islam.
Devrim
Dec 2 2007 12:39
#13
capricorn wrote:
Quote:
The right using this as political capital in order to discredit Muslims?No doubt, but it looks as if some Muslims don't need any help from the right to descredit themselves. Calling for somebody to be executed just for calling a teddy Mohammed! At the very least these Mad Mullahs and their crazed followers could do with a good PR firm. But I agree every time this sort of thing happens (and it seems to happen every month) it's more votes for the BNP. But while the "left" discuss, as here in other threads, how to deal with the threat from the BNP (such as it is) nobody seems interested in discussing how to deal with the threat (much more real, I'd have thought) from these Islamist extremists -- imagine what would happen to us if they got power here: forced to wear a veil or grow a beard or just simply stoned. Wouldn't be politically correct, I suppose.
The right (including but not limited to the BNP) use events like this to gain support the same way that Labour and the main parties use concern about Fascism to get votes. Neither concern is that serious for us in the UK (like Devrim said) but if talking it up can scare some people into supporting you when they otherwise wouldn't have bothered then what does it matter? Fear (especially unjustified fear) makes for great political currency, especially if it can be tied in with other concerns (immigration, 'values' etc).
Revol's right though, leftist apologism for events like this does easily as much (probably a lot more) to turn people to the BNP and the right generally as any right wing response does.
Dec 2 2007 12:41
#14
Devrim wrote:
revol wrote:
they've no chance of coming to power in the UK but they are making further inroads within the muslim community and the liberal left has curtsied to the mad mullahs and their fellow travellers in the name of 'multi culturalsim', their hypocrisy stinks to fuck, they'll be eady to qualify or act as apoligists for anything done by someone with brown skin whilst denouncing white working class people at the first chance they've got.I am not at all suggesting any alliances with imams. I am just saying that we have to be careful to avoid the tone of the right, which you can clearly hear the echoes of in the writings of some anarchists on Islam.
Devrim
The tone of the right? You mean calling shit for what it is? Islam is a crock of shit and anarchists shouldn't be afraid to say so. Also you seem to forget but the imans and the 'community spokespeople' for the muslim community are the right, albeit with swarthier skin.
Dec 2 2007 12:52
#15
revol68 wrote:
The tone of the right? You mean calling shit for what it is? Islam is a crock of shit and anarchists shouldn't be afraid to say so.
I have no problem with saying that Islam is completely reactionary, and have never pretended otherwise. I think that the article on Mohammed in Class War, and the effigy burning are quite clear examples of what I mean, but also talk like this; 'imagine what would happen to us if they got power here: forced to wear a veil or grow a beard or just simply stoned'.
revol68 wrote:
Also you seem to forget but the imans and the 'community spokespeople' for the muslim community are the right, albeit with swarthier skin.
No doubt about it.
Devrim
Dec 2 2007 13:00
#16
The problem with class war is it's just applying the same crass tabloid attitude and actions it does to everyother issue (bash the rich etc, hospitalised copper etc) to an issue that is a damn sight more controversial and where such lack of nuance isn't merely seen as perhaps juevinile, tongue in cheek, posturing or simplistic but rather can come across as somewhat racist and more dangerous, for example Class War members argued vehemently in favour of the head scarf ban in France, failing to understand exactly what whipped it up and who the whole issue was designed to serve, this wasn't out of any racism or whatever but because their politics have never extended beyond simplistic sloganeering.
Dec 2 2007 15:47
#17
revol68 wrote:
this wasn't out of any racism or whatever but because their politics have never extended beyond simplistic sloganeering.
I have never said that it was. The tone comes across as the same though.
Devrim
Dec 2 2007 17:04
#18
Agree with Devrim about the question of tone, it is also important to be able to provide a theoretical/historical analysis of why Islam has become an important question in the last few years. The following article may be of interest:
Resurgent Islam: A symptom of the decomposition of capitalist social relations/http://en.internationalism.org/ir/109_islam.html
Dec 2 2007 20:18
#19
The tone of the BNP is much more effective at finding a place within popular consciousness than one that lends itself to "the decomposition of capitalist social relations". It begs the question of what’s wrong with their tone. What, after all, is a tone for?
Dec 3 2007 14:23
#20
News just in. 
Gillian Gibbons has been granted a full pardon by the Sudanese govt and is now in the care of the British Embassy. This is said to have beeen done after the intervention of two British muslim peers.
Mrs Gibbons said in her statment that she enjoyed her four months of teaching prior to the incident and received nothing but kindess from the Sudanese people. She was at pains to point out that those calling for punishment were a tiny and vocal minority. Exactly what i said. 
Good to hear
Love
LW XX
PS Of course the Sudanese embassador was majorly trying to brush it under the carpet.."it is forgotten now.. well if not forgotten , behind us. " It would be harder for him to "forget" had he been in Mrs. Gibbons position.
Dec 3 2007 15:05
#21
I like to think that the kids named it mohammad on purpose to fuck with the new teacher.
Dec 3 2007 17:11
#22
Lone Wolf wrote:
News just in.Gillian Gibbons has been granted a full pardon by the Sudanese govt and is now in the care of the British Embassy. This is said to have beeen done after the intervention of two British muslim peers.
Mrs Gibbons said in her statment that she enjoyed her four months of teaching prior to the incident and received nothing but kindess from the Sudanese people. She was at pains to point out that those calling for punishment were a tiny and vocal minority. Exactly what i said.
Good to hear
Love
LW XX
PS Of course the Sudanese embassador was majorly trying to brush it under the carpet.."it is forgotten now.. well if not forgotten , behind us. " It would be harder for him to "forget" had he been in Mrs. Gibbons position.
that is not the issue the issue is some fucking reps for UK Islam went over there to beg and apologise on her behalf and have made this shitty statements about this showing how merciful islam is! Wow we didn't horsewhip a 50 year old teacher, we're sooooooooooo all forgiving!
Dec 3 2007 18:07
#23
guydebordisdead wrote:
I like to think that the kids named it mohammad on purpose to fuck with the new teacher.
I was thinking the same thing. Haha.
Dec 3 2007 18:13
#24
theoretical and tactical unity 
Dec 4 2007 04:19
#25
Smash Rich Bastards wrote:
guydebordisdead wrote:
I like to think that the kids named it mohammad on purpose to fuck with the new teacher.I was thinking the same thing. Haha.
Thats the best part of the story. The bear was named after a kid in the class. He's popular and the kids all voted to name the bear after him. Its got nothing to do with the prophet at all.
Dec 4 2007 04:27
#26
Ha it was never about the prophet. Political manoeuvring pure and simple.
(Tho most male children seem to be named after him - must be a bit confusing. 
)
Dec 4 2007 04:53
#27
Lone Wolf wrote:
(Tho most male children seem to be named after him - must be a bit confusing.
Yeah because apparently there is an analogy to draw between Muslim children and toy animals...?
Dec 4 2007 05:44
#28
MJ wrote:
Lone Wolf wrote:
(Tho most male children seem to be named after him - must be a bit confusing.Yeah because apparently there is an analogy to draw between Muslim children and toy animals...?
Oh come on now...
Dec 4 2007 06:41
#29
Why are some people calling him "the prophet" on this thread (like the BBC in England). He was either a hallucinationist, a fantasist or a simple con-man, surely.since neither god nor the archangel gabriel exist. But at least, unlike that other so-called prophet JC, there's solid evidence that he existed.
Dec 4 2007 06:44
#30
capricorn wrote:
Why are some people calling him "the prophet" on this thread (like the BBC in England). He was either a hallucinationist, a fantasist or a simple con-man, surely.since neither god nor the archangel gabriel exist. But at least, unlike that other so-called prophet JC, there's solid evidence that he existed.
Common usage of language is your big beef?
Sorry about that Story here, actually