Terrorist attacks in Norway

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Arbeiten's picture
Arbeiten
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Jul 23 2011 00:54

yeah, but as Cooked says, it's part of controlling information. He also only has the slickest pictures!

You know it is really interesting watching wikipedia change. it has changed like 5 times over the last hour. At one point they had his twitter message up. At another they suggested him as a right-winger. Now there is a section on his admiration for Churchill and Norwegian WW2 hero max Manus. All these little home detectives trying to composite an image of someone they know nothing about....

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klas batalo
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Jul 23 2011 01:01

like cooked said, it seems these profiles were freshly made...if he had previous online identity only facebook and twitter would have access to that and who even knows...i finally did fine the facebook killswitch from a comrade.

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Jul 23 2011 01:16

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/jul/23/norway-attacks-oslo-bombing-youth-camp

"One thing is certain, however and that is the perception in Norway's security services that Islamist terrorism is a bigger threat than the almost unheard domestic terrorism, despite the existence of far right and anarchist groups who of late are alleged to have improved their international contacts."

Sigh.

radicalgraffiti
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Jul 23 2011 03:52

News now reporting that there are more than 80 people killed
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-14259356

People on twitter saying the killed is probably a blogger called Fjordman
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fjordman

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Mr. Jolly
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Jul 23 2011 07:25

The Newsnight (premiere UK news show) presenter mentioned it could be Anarchists behind the attack, even though all the experts interviewed never mentioned the far left as a possibility. One assumes it can be just be put down to ignorance.

batswill
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Jul 23 2011 08:26

Sigh. Wagner and firearms are a bad mix.

ocelot's picture
ocelot
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Jul 23 2011 09:20

Might be worth UK anarchists going on BBC blogs to complain about their default association between mass murder and anarchists. Although they can hide behind that Bradford Uni twat. West Yorks anarchists might want to complain about him (or even challenge him to a public debate - often these guys are arrogant enough to do that).

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jef costello
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Jul 23 2011 09:31

80 shot dead, bloody hell.
So is he trying to destroy the party long term by wiping out their youth wing?
I'd be surprised if he turns out to be the blogger, people who do these things don't seem to put as much thought into the why as the how.

no1
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Jul 23 2011 10:15
ocelot wrote:
Might be worth UK anarchists going on BBC blogs to complain about their default association between mass murder and anarchists. Although they can hide behind that Bradford Uni twat.

Yes I find this association with terrorism really annoying. When was the last time there was any significant anarchist terrorism?

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Jul 23 2011 12:00

The guy arrested has links with the English Defence League:
http://libcom.org/blog/norwegian-spree-killer-had-edl-links-23072011

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Jul 23 2011 13:21

German news says he was a 'self-identified *Christian fundamentalist*'. And that they captured him at the island. The cops refuse to say if there was a shoot out between him and them.

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Jul 23 2011 13:24

(His pics all make him look like he was trying to be a male model. Somehow adds to the creepiness...)

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Jul 23 2011 13:35

I'm a Norwegian, so the event has naturally had a big impact on me. That being said, I am glad this was not an organized muslim attack (they are already unfairly persecuted), and the fact that this is one single man proves that he must be somewhat mentally unstable; 90 deaths or not, the man needs treatment, help, care, not hatred and persecution (which is probably why he did this in the first place)

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Felix Frost
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Jul 23 2011 13:44
Khawaga wrote:
As far as I know the only Norwegians posting here are Felix Frost and myself (and I live in Canada). Felix, are you ok?

Thanks for the concern. I'm not actually in Norway at the moment.

radicalgraffiti wrote:
People on twitter saying the killed is probably a blogger called Fjordman
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fjordman

This has been denied by people who claim to know Fjordman.

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Steven.
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Jul 23 2011 14:23
AnrBjotk wrote:
I'm a Norwegian, so the event has naturally had a big impact on me. That being said, I am glad this was not an organized muslim attack (they are already unfairly persecuted), and the fact that this is one single man proves that he must be somewhat mentally unstable; 90 deaths or not, the man needs treatment, help, care, not hatred and persecution (which is probably why he did this in the first place)

you what? What "treatment" or "care" helps fascist mass-murderers?

And what do you mean "which is probably why he did this in the first place"? That people hated or persecuted him? Seems unlikely, looks like he just hated and persecuted Muslims (and, it would appear, the left)

Boris Badenov
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Jul 23 2011 15:05
arminius wrote:
(His pics all make him look like he was trying to be a male model. Somehow adds to the creepiness...)

His pics make him look like a far more disturbing version of Murray Hewitt imo.

Boris Badenov
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Jul 23 2011 15:06
Old_Goat wrote:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/jul/23/norway-attacks-oslo-bombing-youth-camp

"One thing is certain, however and that is the perception in Norway's security services that Islamist terrorism is a bigger threat than the almost unheard domestic terrorism, despite the existence of far right and anarchist groups who of late are alleged to have improved their international contacts."

Sigh.

FAR RIGHT MUSLAMIC ANARCHISTS - THIS IS THE FUTURE.

Arbeiten's picture
Arbeiten
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Jul 23 2011 15:18

His goatee is SO WEIRD! it looks like an upside down staple....

Boris Badenov
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Jul 23 2011 15:23

Honestly I'm not sure how much this was motivated by genuine ideological "fascism" and how much by chronic terminal douchebaggery.

Lacoste sweater - check
popped collar - check
sculpted facial hair - check
hollow narcissistic smile - check.

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Jul 23 2011 15:30
Steven. wrote:
AnrBjotk wrote:
I'm a Norwegian, so the event has naturally had a big impact on me. That being said, I am glad this was not an organized muslim attack (they are already unfairly persecuted), and the fact that this is one single man proves that he must be somewhat mentally unstable; 90 deaths or not, the man needs treatment, help, care, not hatred and persecution (which is probably why he did this in the first place)

you what? What "treatment" or "care" helps fascist mass-murderers?

And what do you mean "which is probably why he did this in the first place"? That people hated or persecuted him? Seems unlikely, looks like he just hated and persecuted Muslims (and, it would appear, the left)

Well, I wont venture too far as I do not have a full formal education in psychology (nor any in psychiatry). What I can say is that evil begets evil. That all evil deeds have a root (and a blossom). That with very few exceptions are human action unmotivated. Even serial killers have a reason (mental illness, trauma, etc). Evil people are not born that way, evil people are created; We know this because there are more mental illness now than ever before (though that might be a psychiatric invention)
The man is sick. We both agree on that right? Well, for me sick people need treatment. We do not shoot people who have a cold. We help them. And who needs more help than someone who is that far lost that he killed 80 + people?
This person was/is lost. His hatred for muslims and the left can be viewed as misguided at worst, bigoted at best (though the former more than the latter). But there is a very big difference between writing radical essays and killing people. Somewhere along the line he snapped. What happened? Will we ever know for sure. I can say tho that with 80% certainty that something triggered his actions. You cannot kill without having lost a lot of empathy, love and compassion; What stopped him killing for so many years?

We need to treat the sick in "our" society. From cancer patients to patients of mental illness, something this man is a prime example of.

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Arbeiten
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Jul 23 2011 15:55

I think what Steven is getting at is you implying he is just as 'hated and persecuted' as the muslims that he hates so much.

Though I see your point Anr, I think it is a bit crass and a bit soon. You can't generalize from having a cold to murdering nearly 100 people under the umbrella term 'sick'. It is much more complex than that, and your cheap humanism to the contrary, much more of an ethical blind spot.

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Jul 23 2011 15:59

The coverage of this story on the BBC world service is making me sick. These journalists are vultures. The worst thing is that this one journalist is trying to imply that Norwegian society was 'naive' and should have adopted a more authoritarian attitude to the public as happened in the US and the UK after 9/11.

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Jul 23 2011 16:10
AnrBjotk wrote:
We know this because there are more mental illness now than ever before (though that might be a psychiatric invention)

No there aren't. The difference is that the mental illnesses now are diagnosed as such, before Schizophrenia, Autism,etc were attributed to witchery, devil possession and other myths.

slothjabber
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Jul 23 2011 16:14

sorry, mistaken post

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Jul 23 2011 16:41

The guy looks like what we Norwegians refer to as "soss", i.e. bourgeois. The hair, the clothes, lived at the affluent Western part of Oslo the name even etc. He was a member of the Masons. It is a good thing that he was a member of Fremskrittspartiet, which is a "far-ish", racist right-wing party.

He got hold of the bomb making ingredients by establishing a business supposed to grow vegetables (he moved to an agricultural area not long ago to probably prepare). Apparently he was active online, meaning one of those that write racist comments in newspapers and on YouTube. He was a contributor to document.no, an anti-muslim website. Self-described nationalist who believed that the fight was not against socialism and capitalism, but internationalism. I havent read anything about motivation, but likely it is about immigration policy (which has been tough since the 70s in any case).

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Jul 23 2011 17:18
Malva wrote:
The coverage of this story on the BBC world service is making me sick. These journalists are vultures. The worst thing is that this one journalist is trying to imply that Norwegian society was 'naive' and should have adopted a more authoritarian attitude to the public as happened in the US and the UK after 9/11.

Well you can relax now then. Because both Sky and BBC News have now switched from the story of a hundred Norwegians being murdered to the, apparently, much more important story that some junkie has OD'd. Nice to see the media have their priorities back to normal.

On the "nazi or mentally ill" question, I have to say that there is a consistent pattern of de-politicising nazi crimes (e.g. David Copeland, that French guy who tried to assassinate Chirac, etc...) by pathologising the perpetrator and making into a mental illness story. Personally I think being able to arrange your affairs to obtain the fertiliser, diesel etc for a "readimix" device, assemble it without blowing yourself up, get it to detonate remotely and then manage the largest body count single-shooter massacre that anyone can remember, is not the act of a disordered or delusional consciousness. This guy's not mad, he's a perfectly sane political soldier - just that his politics happen to be thoroughly evil.

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Jul 23 2011 17:29
Khawaga wrote:
The guy looks like what we Norwegians refer to as "soss", i.e. bourgeois. The hair, the clothes, lived at the affluent Western part of Oslo the name even etc. He was a member of the Masons. It is a good thing that he was a member of Fremskrittspartiet, which is a "far-ish", racist right-wing party.

He got hold of the bomb making ingredients by establishing a business supposed to grow vegetables (he moved to an agricultural area not long ago to probably prepare). Apparently he was active online, meaning one of those that write racist comments in newspapers and on YouTube. He was a contributor to document.no, an anti-muslim website. Self-described nationalist who believed that the fight was not against socialism and capitalism, but internationalism. I havent read anything about motivation, but likely it is about immigration policy (which has been tough since the 70s in any case).

I'm sure more information about his motivations will be coming out in the next few days, as he's reportedly happy to cooperate with the cops and explain his motivations.

On document.no a lot of his posts go on about "cultural marxism", supposedly working hand in hand with Muslims to erode Christian values, marginalise Israel, bring about "Eurabia" etc. My guess is that his motivation will be taking this on, in the form of the Labour party.

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Jul 23 2011 17:48

Yeah, that's likely why he attacked the labour party. The so-called willing idiots of Islamization of Norway. Even though the Labour Party has been hard on immigration for ever (I mean as far as I know there is still an immigration stop in Norway).

Quote:
On the "nazi or mentally ill" question, I have to say that there is a consistent pattern of de-politicising nazi crimes (e.g. David Copeland, that French guy who tried to assassinate Chirac, etc...) by pathologising the perpetrator and making into a mental illness story. Personally I think being able to arrange your affairs to obtain the fertiliser, diesel etc for a "readimix" device, assemble it without blowing yourself up, get it to detonate remotely and then manage the largest body count single-shooter massacre that anyone can remember, is not the act of a disordered or delusional consciousness. This guy's not mad, he's a perfectly sane political soldier - just that his politics happen to be thoroughly evil.

Good point. From what I've read he didn't seem mentally ill, he seemed to have his marbles.

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Jul 23 2011 17:51

To add, he referred to former labour PM Gro Harlem Brudtland as the Country Murderer (landsmorderen), which is a play on her status as the Mother of the Country (landsmoren). She spoke at the summer camp earlier in the day.

no1
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Jul 23 2011 18:26

I'm just noticing that stormfront are no longer publicly accessible without a login, but google indexed a 17+ page discussion on the Norwegian terrorist attack (unfortunately no cache) - maybe Breivik posted on Stormfront?