They glued locks and spraypainted stuff? When I saw ELF, I expected fire. How half-arsed 
ELF UK debut
breakout wrote:
It is not a debut. ELF started in Brighton in the early 90's. There has been 1 other ELF action this year in the UK to my knowledge. In early March 14 SUV's were trashed at a dealership near Hereford.
i new the ELF started in the UK but i didn't know people were claiming actions.
Rural 4x4's - yes they are dead handy (and actually quite handy for the school run in chelsea too i'm sure fwiw) but thats hardly the point being made. If you accept global warming is happening there would have to be a lot of very inconvenient changes.
I'm not just sceptical. Doing stuff like this is not only doing too little damage to prevent rebuilding, it's destroying resources which then get replaced, thus doubling the environmental damage over the medium term with costs recuperated through insurers (and passed on to consumers/workers by bosses - not that I care unduly about extra costs for the sort of person who can afford a brand new 4x4, but still...).
i dunno that they ARE an organisation guy.
ALF style bollocks.
Thats why i said i'd be able to nab them in a week if i were a cop. All ALF and ELF people were also liberal campaigners, in this case they've be so kind as to tell the police exactly which campaign they are involved with.
Tacks wrote:
breakout wrote:
It is not a debut. ELF started in Brighton in the early 90's. There has been 1 other ELF action this year in the UK to my knowledge. In early March 14 SUV's were trashed at a dealership near Hereford.i new the ELF started in the UK but i didn't know people were claiming actions.
Rural 4x4's - yes they are dead handy (and actually quite handy for the school run in chelsea too i'm sure fwiw) but thats hardly the point being made. If you accept global warming is happening there would have to be a lot of very inconvenient changes.
Communism being the most important of those inconvenient changes
Tacks wrote:
i dunno that they ARE an organisation guy.ALF style bollocks.
Thats why i said i'd be able to nab them in a week if i were a cop. All ALF and ELF people were also liberal campaigners, in this case they've be so kind as to tell the police exactly which campaign they are involved with.
I agree. Not an organisation in any sense of the word that we'd know but I reckon it won't take the cops long to find out who did it. Then the whole anarchist movement can waste valuable time and resources on supporting these cowboys.
guydebordisdead wrote:
In the states half of them turned out to be cops and loads of the others ratted on each other. Solidarity my bollox.
Besides the paid FBI informant "Anne Davies" (who was an informant, not an actual agent) in the conspiracy case in Sacramento, where else have there been cops involved in ELF actions? To be clear, the Sacramento case is about conspiracy to commit actions - no actual actions happened - and I don't think it was ELF.
"Half of them turned out to be cops" is a lie. In the Operation Backfire case a number of the defendants did rat on each other - and some of them remained principled - but none of them were cops.
It was an obvious generalisation and not a statement of statistics. People involved in burning suv's and other elf-style activities in the states turned out to be cops or informants, some others turned on each other for shorter sentences and even more were neither cops nor rats. Ok?
Where do you stand on the ELF, yoshomon, as an anti-civ/marxist?
"Radical environmentalism" of both the Earth First! and ELF variety confuse me. I'm down for supporting ELF prisoners, particularly the non-cooperating defendants in Operation Backfire, but I am not excited by the ELF at all.
Who involved in ELF style actions has turned out to be a cop? Maybe I'm ignorant or forgetting something, but if you don't have any evidence of this it's a bullshit thing to say. Yes, let's be critical of the ELF, but saying that people involved are police is slander.
Quote:
There is most certainly wide scale infiltration of that scene.
Let's be honest, most political organisations have more than their fair share of spooks – if the television series of that name were more honest it would just show long repetitious meetings with people trying to out quote each other. ALF and ELF type 'affinity groups' are an attempt to stop this kind of infiltration. It’s too bad that they’re full of puritanical fantasists who are desperate to get caught just so they can wallow in martyrdom.
Yosh, how the flying fuck can you be an ''anti-civ marxist''? Seriosuly fuck off thats the most ridiculous political label i've ever heard in my life.
yoshomon wrote:
"Radical environmentalism" of both the Earth First! and ELF variety confuse me. I'm down for supporting ELF prisoners, particularly the non-cooperating defendants in Operation Backfire, but I am not excited by the ELF at all.
Why exactly should we make the effort to support them? I don't see any logical reason to do so, other than some vague notion about how ''the state yeah, its like bad'''. I don't feel i have anything in common with some loony who burns buildings because ''civilisation is bad''. I mean if you did that in a communist society i'd still think you should be put in jail.
cantdocartwheels wrote:
Quote:
if you did that in a communist society i'd still think you should be put in jail.
If cantdocartwheel's communist society stills has prisons (and probably factories for that matter), then can somebody please tell me what the fuck is to be gained from communism?
Hagbard Celine wrote:
cantdocartwheels wrote:Quote:
if you did that in a communist society i'd still think you should be put in jail.If cantdocartwheel's communist society stills has prisons (and probably factories for that matter), then can somebody please tell me what the fuck is to be gained from communism?
Factories are as bad as prisons? Smash the industrial-industrial complex!
w00t
UK now on par with US, silliness ahoy!