Ok, last licks for me and Chuck you're welcome to take another shot at me. Then it's best that we move on.
ok.
We do not have to like each other to discuss things. It's the manner in which they're discussed. I often times agree with some of your trade union views. But they can get lost or sidetracked.This is what I was refering to Chuck:
throwhen http://libcom.org/forums/bin/yank-bun-fight#comment-
Mon, 22/01/2007 - 04:15
"fuck nefac.
fuck leftists.
fuck tom, mitch and even that canadian fucker mick.They haven't organized workers and wouldn't know how to if they had to."
It's perfectly reasonable for people to agree or disagree over specifics or in general. Perhaps your affinity with your union, the style of your union and so forth bonds you to that union. Ok, cool. Everyones experiance is different. Every union is different.Many unions have transformed themseleves into more trade union oriented organizations rather than fiefdoms of the past. Your union is geenerally one of them. But not all are.
i'm proud of my union and the workers. i trust the leadership and have every reason too.
i'm also part of the leadership of my local; as a negotiator and leader of the gaming division.
To say that your experiance is the only experiance, that others experiances or observations are not, well, that's where we can part ways.
your experience is valid. i just think it's dated.
still very true in many parts of the country and in many unions, but that the labor movement is changing and that need to be reflected in your vision.
As I have no desire to make this about me, yet you've made some statements that show you have no idea about me, I'll say this. I'm a former factory and warehouse worker who was taken out of the shop to work for his local. I then returned to the shop and then hired onto a progressive union organizing and assiting industrial workers in organizing, grievances and contract negotiation. I finished my union stint in healthcare and president of the satff union. I am currently self-employed after my father suddenly died suddenly and I took over his one-man tombstone business.
congrats. i organized my own union as a painter before becoming an organizer. Doesn't make me right, but it also doesn't make me wrong.
I have always retained a rank-and-file perspective and have approached all my work from this angle. My industrial experiances in the workplace and in assisiting other workers came during a period of intesnse attacks on the working class. Plant closings, lock-outs, major drive for concessions on wages and terms and coditions of employment and general de-industrializtion of my area. My healthcare experiances were with workers who had no protection under the NLRB and, therefore, it was through our ability to maintain self-organization and stamina that we were able to prevail.
my organizing was with construction workers and casino workers. I started and for five years organized tribal casino workers with no rights under the NLRB or any other laws. It was only through discipline and a clear plan that we were able to beat the combined strength of the casino management and government.
That's my story. So I guess I have some idea of what I'm talking about.
me too...
So let's just agree to disagree where there are disagreements. Let's share whatever knowledge and experiance we have with others. And for all, let's keep things civil and hold back on the cussing and name calling--everyone.
you too...
To Flint and others, sorry to have momentarily derailed your conversation.
me too...
Can comment on articles and discussions
Ok, last licks for me and Chuck you're welcome to take another shot at me. Then it's best that we move on.
We do not have to like each other to discuss things. It's the manner in which they're discussed. I often times agree with some of your trade union views. But they can get lost or sidetracked.
This is what I was refering to Chuck:
throwhen http://libcom.org/forums/bin/yank-bun-fight#comment-
Mon, 22/01/2007 - 04:15
"fuck nefac.
fuck leftists.
fuck tom, mitch and even that canadian fucker mick.
They haven't organized workers and wouldn't know how to if they had to."
It's perfectly reasonable for people to agree or disagree over specifics or in general. Perhaps your affinity with your union, the style of your union and so forth bonds you to that union. Ok, cool. Everyones experiance is different. Every union is different.Many unions have transformed themseleves into more trade union oriented organizations rather than fiefdoms of the past. Your union is geenerally one of them. But not all are.
To say that your experiance is the only experiance, that others experiances or observations are not, well, that's where we can part ways.
As I have no desire to make this about me, yet you've made some statements that show you have no idea about me, I'll say this. I'm a former factory and warehouse worker who was taken out of the shop to work for his local. I then returned to the shop and then hired onto a progressive union organizing and assiting industrial workers in organizing, grievances and contract negotiation. I finished my union stint in healthcare and president of the satff union. I am currently self-employed after my father suddenly died suddenly and I took over his one-man tombstone business.
I have always retained a rank-and-file perspective and have approached all my work from this angle. My industrial experiances in the workplace and in assisiting other workers came during a period of intesnse attacks on the working class. Plant closings, lock-outs, major drive for concessions on wages and terms and coditions of employment and general de-industrializtion of my area. My healthcare experiances were with workers who had no protection under the NLRB and, therefore, it was through our ability to maintain self-organization and stamina that we were able to prevail.
That's my story. So I guess I have some idea of what I'm talking about.
So let's just agree to disagree where there are disagreements. Let's share whatever knowledge and experiance we have with others. And for all, let's keep things civil and hold back on the cussing and name calling--everyone.
To Flint and others, sorry to have momentarily derailed your conversation.