SPGB getting £166,000 in 3 months
Feb 27 2007 14:13
The Metro today on p2 today had a story about political party funding. In the last quarter of last year it listed party's donations, and just below the Blah party (WTF?) was the SPGB, receiving £166,000.
For comparison the tories got £5m and the SNP £550,000, BNP £22,000 and Green Party just under £5,000.
What the hell? Who's giving them all that money? Was it a one-off thing, inheritance of a house maybe? Or do they always get that? And if so how do they manage to make so little impact with it?
Feb 27 2007 15:05
#2
THE SPGB is a very aging party, as a result of which there are quite a few deaths of party members per year with them leaving money to the Small Party of Good Boys in their wills
Feb 27 2007 15:11
#3
Probably inheritance although an organisation of 350 would have that income if they had a 3% subs rate and an average members income of 15,000. (or 175 members and average income of 30,000). Doesn't the SPGB have quite a big paper membership?
Feb 27 2007 15:50
#4
Battlescarred wrote:
THE SPGB is a very aging party, as a result of which there are quite a few deaths of party members per year with them leaving money to the Small Party of Good Boys in their wills
Would it be worth taking them over then in a few years?
Feb 27 2007 15:56
#5
It will be an inheritance. Either a member or members died and left their money to the SPGB or alternatively a relative of a member died and that member gave a large part of their inheritance to the organisation.
It's very unlikely to be subs income for a couple of reasons:
1) I suspect that as in Ireland, donations are only published if they are fairly substantial. A lot of small donations wouldn't make the list.
2) I believe that the SPGB sets low membership subscriptions anyway, in keeping with a membership system which doesn't require members to do anything.
Joe is right though that an organisation of any size at all which takes itself seriously should be able to raise substantial amounts of money through subs. The English Socialist Party (which is admittedly a lot bigger) raises that kind of money through small donations to its fighting fund, before you even get to subs income. As any good trot will tell you, finance is a political issue.
Feb 27 2007 15:59
#6
John. wrote:
Would it be worth taking them over then in a few years?
No.
A) Despite a slow decline, the SPGB will still be able to muster more members than any sufficiently organised British anarchist group for many years to come.
B) Their assets will in all probability be held in various trusts, which you won't be able to get near.
Feb 27 2007 16:03
#7
The NZ version was also loaded due to inheritance. It was also minute but had written into it's constitution that if the party folds all money goes to the parent party in Britain.
Feb 27 2007 19:01
#8
Hi
Quote:
My question is why cant we get that much money!
Because you're all a bunch of losers with personality issues.
Love
LR
Feb 27 2007 19:47
#9
Lazy Riser wrote:
Because you're all a bunch of losers with personality issues.
No. This would not explain how EF/Resist G8/UK 'anti-capitalism' picked up around half a million a couple of years ago...
Feb 27 2007 19:49
#10
Lazy Riser wrote:
Quote:
My question is why cant we get that much money!Because you're all a bunch of losers with personality issues.
Whilst that may be true it doesn't seem to have stopped the SPGB.
Those old fossils will waste the money anyway. What are they going to do with it? A few leaflets no-one will read, a book or two that will only sell to members? On the other hand what might anarchist organisations do with that kind of money?
If this kind of money existed and was destined for anarchist causes I guess I'd choose to spend it on Freedom and on the bookfair. A trust fund maybe?
If ten times this sum came our way I'd still spend some on those causes but I'd also do what the CNT did in Spain some years ago and set up an ecological and community project to develop new land-use and appropriate technology solutions for use in libertarian communities. I can dream.
Feb 27 2007 19:49
#11
posi wrote:
Lazy Riser wrote:
Because you're all a bunch of losers with personality issues.No. This would not explain how EF/Resist G8/UK 'anti-capitalism' picked up around half a million a couple of years ago...
Actually I think that explains it rather well. 
Feb 27 2007 20:33
#12
The SPGB (publishers of the Socialist Standard), has many faults arising from its origins in the 'impossibilist' revolt amongst turn of the century British Social Democracy' along with the British version of the American Socialist Labour Party (though they did have the saving grace of an attempt to link up organisationally with the collective struggle in the workplace). The SPGB's continual refusal to face up to the problems of its own origins and take an active part in the every day class struggle may well justify its description by some as the 'Small Party of Good Boys' , but that said it does still produce some fairly good basic propaganda in favour of socialism/communism of a variety few anarchists would have much against. In this area at least it regularly produces material far superior to much of what we can read in the regular anarchist press.
It is probably this activity that has assured it over the years a continuing, if irregular, influx of younger members and an overal membership generally larger than most anarchist groups.
If I am not mistaken there are also anumber of anarchist and libertarian communists who have there origins in or close to the SPGB at different points in its history.
It may be true that some anarchist and other libertarian communist groups could make better use of the kind of money mentioned here, but unfortunately not all of them!
Feb 27 2007 20:34
#13
Hi
Quote:
No. This would not explain how EF/Resist G8/UK 'anti-capitalism' picked up around half a million a couple of years ago...
Comrade. That stuff isn't against capitalism, it's part of it. My personal balance sheet dwarfs the lot of 'em anyway, so you can all go and swivel.
Quote:
do what the CNT did in Spain some years ago and set up an ecological and community project to develop new land-use and appropriate technology solutions for use in libertarian communities
Oh yeah that worked a treat. I mean, Spain, even UK chavs can buy up whole villages there just to turn them into theme pubs.
Love
LR
Feb 27 2007 21:04
#14
Depends what you mean by "worked" lazy. It was a great innovative and inspirational place when I visited it. How do you know whether it worked or not? What kind of timescale are you working on? It's a little early to tell I would say and anyway perhaps you're definition of "worked" is more than a little diferent from mine eh?
Feb 27 2007 22:00
#15
The £166,000 was an inheritance from a member.
As for all the "Small Party of Good Boys" crap, it's ironic that "libertarians" are slagging off the SPGB using leninist/trotskyist smears. The SPGB has maintained a rather large party - certainly for much of it's history as large/larger and as active than most of the non-CPGB Leninist left groups in the UK. And certainly expodentially larger than the anarchist/councilists, even though it is run much like an anarchist group should be - without leaders and democratic.
As for participating in the class struggle, the SPGB & friends has always participated, but doesn't make a show of it like the Trots, et al. I'm a member of the SPGB's US sister party and I know here we were very active in the Auto workers sitdown and wildcat movements, the founding of the United Auto Workers Union, etc. I don't know enough of the SPGB's history to say what they were involved in, but I know that they had a great deal of respect for our activity here, which they certainly would have denounced if they truly are against being involved in class struggles. And the Canadian party was even more involved in struggles.
Feb 27 2007 22:00
#16
Hi
Quote:
It was a great innovative and inspirational place when I visited it.
Whatever. They’d be better off investing in reverse osmosis plants, unless they did, in which case good on ‘em.
Quote:
it's ironic that "libertarians" are slagging off the SPGB using leninist/trotskyist smears
Indeed. I was politely overlooking it. The SPGB are true stalwarts of the mirage of moneyless communism.
Love
LR
Feb 27 2007 22:42
#17
Lazy Riser wrote:
Quote:
It was a great innovative and inspirational place when I visited it.Whatever. They’d be better off investing in reverse osmosis plants, unless they did, in which case good on ‘em.
Oh "whatever", devastating Lazy, you're a prince among quippers! You know shit about the subject that much is obvious.
Feb 27 2007 23:18
#18
Hi
Quote:
You know shit about the subject that much is obvious.
Indeed. I see you share their incapacity to communicate its meaning and content beyond “inspiring” niche-reactionaries on tour from other countries. I’m sure it’s all very worthwhile though, really. You've got to agree, Spain's drinking water plants are ace though.
Some may be surprised to know that I do share some key positions with the SPGB. I wonder if anyone can guess what they are.
Love
LR
I'm lovin' the br's.
Feb 28 2007 02:42
#19
In the US they have an affiliate World Socialist Party (http://www.worldsocialism.org/usa/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page). Their stuff was as tough as the US SLP's to get through, but I remember them having a particularly left wing critique of leninism. This was years ago that I read their stuff. while they seemed "old" back in the 1970s, their critique of leninism seemed fresh to a young rebel just starting to find their way.
Anyway, back in the 1970s old time Wobblies willed the IWW lots of things. But much of it was pissed away.
Hey, the WSA could use some cash, so the next time you're writing your will, remember the Workers Solidarity Alliance.
Feb 28 2007 05:49
#20
Yes, Syndicalist, the SPGB, WSP-US, Socialist Party of Canada, et al. had a pretty coherient line on the Bolshevik revolution while Emma Goldman and Alex Berkman were working for the Bolshies! As we both remember, the 1970s were a bleak time for many anti-Leninist groups, the WSP no exception, became rather insular, almost sectarian.
Feb 28 2007 07:32
#21
Reverse osmosis is hardly a cure for Spain's water problems from what I understand. They'd be better off stopping watering golf courses and sorting out the use of water by the tourist industry to the detriment of local communities. Believe it or not there are very good, tried and tested as well as innovative, ecological techniques for coping with and even slowing or reversing desertification. The CNT-sponsored community that I visited experimented with drip irrigation for sub-tropical fruit in a landscape that was being gradually reafforested.
Feb 28 2007 07:44
#22
The SPGB is excellent proof that you can be nice, civilised, affable, provocative and even fairly libertarian in your day-to-day practice and still be an completely misguided and irrelevent.
Does the SPGB really hold that a working class revolution can be brought about through the ballot box and that therefore the tools for revolutionary change already exist? This beggars belief.
I think that they should buy themselves a little piece of land and some tools and grow some vegetables instead. If they have any change they could buy a shed (medium) and a stormkettle (small) and then they'll have somewhere to sit and have a cup of tea when it rains.
Feb 28 2007 09:20
#23
posi wrote:
Lazy Riser wrote:
Because you're all a bunch of losers with personality issues.No. This would not explain how EF/Resist G8/UK 'anti-capitalism' picked up around half a million a couple of years ago...
Just to clarify, it wasn't half a million. It was money through an inheritance. About £30,000 to 30 groups (£1,000 each) and £10,000 to 7 social centre collectives including Common Place (leeds), OARC (oxford), Basement (Manchester) , G32 (Glasgow), WDY (Newcastle)...etc. Money was also made available to DISSENT though lets get this straight it was NOT £500,000 or even £250,000. DISSENT actually recuperated alot of the costs through the kitchens at the DISSENT camp, benefits, donations..etc.
how much money has been wasted on FREEDOM press over the years? I heard there have me quite a few times where money/property have been left to it.
Feb 28 2007 10:32
#24
Hi
Quote:
Does the SPGB really hold that a working class revolution can be brought about through the ballot box and that therefore the tools for revolutionary change already exist?
Not really. They do, as far as I can work out, understand that if they managed to convince a majority of the case for their brand of socialism, then it would obviously be reflected in parliament and (foreign interventionism aside) there’d be no military stand off between the people and the state. They, correctly, assert that liberal democracy is at least an approximate representation of the “will of the people”, for better or worse. In the modern age the differentiation between reformism and extra-parliamentarianism is imaginary, but then I suppose it depends on what you want to achieve.
Quote:
I think that they should buy themselves a little piece of land and some tools and grow some vegetables instead.
Dig for Victory. The instauration of a self-managed economy will result in the complete collapse of Sterling (if it still exists, if we’re in the Eurozone by then the consequence of issuing new Euros will be even more interesting). As Castoriadis pointed out, the continuation of our much needed food imports (let alone international travel) would be nigh impossible, so I have to begrudgingly agree with you. If the super markets own all the farms by then, I suppose some kind of self-managed version of them may offer something approaching a solution.
Love
LR
Apr 7 2007 23:18
#25
tsiatko wrote:
The £166,000 was an inheritance from a member.As for all the "Small Party of Good Boys" crap, it's ironic that "libertarians" are slagging off the SPGB using leninist/trotskyist smears. .
If you're going to run with the dogs you must learn to bark with them. The problem with associating with Leninists Trots and Maoists on anti-fash marches (wasted effort - the cure for racism is socialism) is that you can become one olf them without realising it.
Apr 7 2007 23:25
#26
Blacknred Ned wrote:
The SPGB is excellent proof that you can be nice, civilised, affable, provocative and even fairly libertarian in your day-to-day practice and still be an completely misguided and irrelevent.Does the SPGB really hold that a working class revolution can be brought about through the ballot box and that therefore the tools for revolutionary change already exist? This beggars belief.
I think that they should buy themselves a little piece of land and some tools and grow some vegetables instead. If they have any change they could buy a shed (medium) and a stormkettle (small) and then they'll have somewhere to sit and have a cup of tea when it rains.
Of course violent revolution has been so successful. It has given us Joe "50,000,000 dead Stalin", Chairman "Great Leap Forward" Mao, Fidel "Queer Basher" Castro and god knows how many wannabes in eastern Europe and Africa.
I would rather wait a thousand years than dabble in any worker violent revolution. Of course I'm sure Stalin meant well.
Apr 8 2007 00:27
#27
Merrie England wrote:
Blacknred Ned wrote:
The SPGB is excellent proof that you can be nice, civilised, affable, provocative and even fairly libertarian in your day-to-day practice and still be an completely misguided and irrelevent.Does the SPGB really hold that a working class revolution can be brought about through the ballot box and that therefore the tools for revolutionary change already exist? This beggars belief.
I think that they should buy themselves a little piece of land and some tools and grow some vegetables instead. If they have any change they could buy a shed (medium) and a stormkettle (small) and then they'll have somewhere to sit and have a cup of tea when it rains.
Of course violent revolution has been so successful. It has given us Joe "50,000,000 dead Stalin", Chairman "Great Leap Forward" Mao, Fidel "Queer Basher" Castro and god knows how many wannabes in eastern Europe and Africa.
I would rather wait a thousand years than dabble in any worker violent revolution. Of course I'm sure Stalin meant well.
Right cause that's a meaningful critique.
I mean FFS you're basically saying that they were interested in revolution, the problem was that they used violence.
I hope I don't have to explain why that has nothing to do with reality.
Apr 8 2007 09:42
#28
electoral commission site is good for finding out where chunky donations have come from
Apr 8 2007 10:55
#29
Hm so three deaths and an individual donation. Interesting.
Apr 8 2007 10:58
#30
I make it five deaths and an individual donation since 2005.
My question is why cant we get that much money!