Saudi gang-rape victim is jailed
Nov 15 2007 23:51
BBC story
An appeal court in Saudi Arabia has doubled the number of lashes and added a jail sentence as punishment for a woman who was gang-raped.
Fuck it's hard not to be sick while reading that.
Nov 16 2007 00:20
#2
Nov 16 2007 16:19
#3
j.rogue wrote:
I'll be expecting the press release from the First Lady supporting an American invasion of Saudi Arabia to save the women.
Hillary will save her if Laura don't.
Nov 16 2007 17:07
#4
it is not the first time. Few years ago it happened to an algerian woman who was in Saudi Arabia. And yes, according to the Charia, what the fuck was she doing with men not related to her?
Nov 21 2007 00:12
#5
j.rogue wrote:
I'll be expecting the press release from the First Lady supporting an American invasion of Saudi Arabia to save the women.
does the first lady have any sort of power or is she just a wife? i thought she was just supposed to wear 'nice' dresses, smile and wave, like the queen?
i dont know why you even mentioned her tbh. men did the rape, men did the sentencing, men will do the violent punishment and the imprisoning. men here and over your way who actually have some power to stop it all will most likely choose to do nothing instead. why comment on the uselessness of the first lady when there's all these guilty guys to point at?
Nov 21 2007 01:12
#6
arf wrote:
j.rogue wrote:
I'll be expecting the press release from the First Lady supporting an American invasion of Saudi Arabia to save the women.does the first lady have any sort of power or is she just a wife? i thought she was just supposed to wear 'nice' dresses, smile and wave, like the queen?
i dont know why you even mentioned her tbh. men did the rape, men did the sentencing, men will do the violent punishment and the imprisoning. men here and over your way who actually have some power to stop it all will most likely choose to do nothing instead. why comment on the uselessness of the first lady when there's all these guilty guys to point at?
eh because the first lady was happy to be wined and fucking dined by the Saudi fucks and if i remember the bitch had no problem spouting shite about liberating Afghani women. And yes it was men who carried out the rape but what the fuck does that even mean? Why stop there? Why pin it on men? Why not say it was Muslims or Arabs or Saudi's in general? i suspect you'd realise it was wankerish and racist to spout shit about arabs or muslims in such generalised ways so why the fuck do it about 'men'?
Nov 21 2007 01:22
#7
revol68 wrote:
Why stop there? Why pin it on men? Why not say it was Muslims or Arabs or Saudi's in general? i suspect you'd realise it was wankerish and racist to spout shit about arabs or muslims in such generalised ways so why the fuck do it about 'men'?
some Muslims/arabs/saudis are women and as such are eternal victims and purified by suffering. All men are rapists.
Nov 21 2007 03:51
#8
arf, (my emphasis) wrote:
j.rogue wrote:
I'll be expecting the press release from the First Lady supporting an American invasion of Saudi Arabia to save the women.does the first lady have any sort of power or is she just a wife? i thought she was just supposed to wear 'nice' dresses, smile and wave, like the queen?
i dont know why you even mentioned her tbh. men did the rape, men did the sentencing, men will do the violent punishment and the imprisoning. men here and over your way who actually have some power to stop it all will most likely choose to do nothing instead. why comment on the uselessness of the first lady when there's all these guilty guys to point at?
I find this kind of talk frightening as it is based on the lines that are used when the bombs start falling. They tend to kill men, women, and children.
Of course, it is not going to happen in Saudi, but I hear they do the same sort of thing in Iran. Why not lend your voice to those 'who actually have some power to stop it' there instead.
Devrim
Nov 21 2007 20:36
#9
arf wrote:
j.rogue wrote:
I'll be expecting the press release from the First Lady supporting an American invasion of Saudi Arabia to save the women.does the first lady have any sort of power or is she just a wife? i thought she was just supposed to wear 'nice' dresses, smile and wave, like the queen?
i dont know why you even mentioned her tbh. men did the rape, men did the sentencing, men will do the violent punishment and the imprisoning. men here and over your way who actually have some power to stop it all will most likely choose to do nothing instead. why comment on the uselessness of the first lady when there's all these guilty guys to point at?
Because over here it became fashionable for the wives of men in power to call for "freeing the women of Afghanistan." Save them from their men!
Devrim is right about the danger of the attitude that America has the power to stop this kind of thing. Not only is it paternalistic (notice Laura Bush was in no hurry to extol the virtues of RAWA), but war, obviously, has a terrible impact on women.
Nov 22 2007 03:24
#10
Quote:
All men are rapists.
Is that meant to be a joke? If not, it is one of the most sexist things I have ever read in my entire life. It's like if I said that all women are silly bimbos. No, what you said is worse.
Quote:
war, obviously, has a terrible impact on women.
War has a terrible impact on everybody, men included. I don't think that can be disputed.
Nov 22 2007 15:30
#11
Zazaban wrote:
all women are silly bimbos.
Fixed.
Nov 22 2007 16:18
#12
thugarchist wrote:
Zazaban wrote:
all women are silly bimbos.
Fixed.
I don't quite get your point. Are you calling me sexist?
Nov 22 2007 17:00
#13
Zazaban, jeff does not think that all men are rapists. he was satirising arf's politics.
Nov 22 2007 17:05
#14
pingtiao wrote:
Zazaban, jeff does not think that all men are rapists. he was satirising arf's politics.
not arf's exactly. But he was being very sarcastic.
Nov 22 2007 19:05
#15
thugarchist wrote:
Zazaban wrote:
all women are silly bimbos.
Fixed.
Oh really?
Nov 22 2007 20:07
#16
John. wrote:
pingtiao wrote:
Zazaban, jeff does not think that all men are rapists. he was satirising arf's politics.not arf's exactly. But he was being very sarcastic.
Ah, thank goodness. I did ask if it was serious. 
I can get very fervent in a debate.
Nov 22 2007 20:54
#17
j.rogue wrote:
thugarchist wrote:
Zazaban wrote:
all women are silly bimbos.
Fixed.
Oh really?
Merely a sardonic meta-commentary on the reverse-sexism thrust of his post.
Nov 23 2007 00:16
#18
thugarchist wrote:
j.rogue wrote:
thugarchist wrote:
Zazaban wrote:
all women are silly bimbos.
Fixed.
Oh really?
Merely a sardonic meta-commentary on the reverse-sexism thrust of his post.
Reverse sexism? Really?
Nov 23 2007 00:28
#19
Zazaban wrote:
thugarchist wrote:
j.rogue wrote:
thugarchist wrote:
Zazaban wrote:
all women are silly bimbos.
Fixed.
Oh really?
Merely a sardonic meta-commentary on the reverse-sexism thrust of his post.
Reverse sexism? Really?
No. I just wanted to italicize the word thrust.
Nov 23 2007 00:47
#20
There is all sorts of fucked-up shit that goes on in Saudi Arabia, but don't expect the US to do anything about it (and if they did, I would question intentions). Better hope to stop US-backing of their ruling class and NGOs to try to at least keep the world's focus on these kinds of actions. And, of course, support the right of workers in Saudi Arabia to organize.
The craziest thing I ever read calling for action in Saudi Arabia was actually an ad in the Progressive magazine several years ago, calling for the carpet bombing of Saudi Arabia to stamp out the scurge of Wahabbi Islam. The edior received several nasty e-mails and subscription cancellations (including mine), to which he tried to plead "free speech."
We also have a tendency to conflate the actions of the ruling class with working class. There are tons of foreign workers in Saudi Arabia who are not religious at all, btw.
Michael Moore was good at lumping everyone together in his hating on Saudis in Farenheit 9-11.
Nov 23 2007 10:51
#21
pghwob wrote:
We also have a tendency to conflate the actions of the ruling class with working class. There are tons of foreign workers in Saudi Arabia who are not religious at all, btw.
I'm sure some saudis are ok as well...
Quote:
Michael Moore was good at lumping everyone together in his hating on Saudis in Farenheit 9-11.
Yeah that pissed me off, it looked similar to jewish-conspiracy type nonsense.
Dec 18 2007 16:23
#22
Update! The woman has been granted a Royal Pardon and released.
The official reason is that officials were "concerned for her health" following repeated suicide attempts following on from her series of ordeals. Shame they weren't "concerned" for her earlier really. 
Dec 18 2007 16:41
#23
a bizarre thing that has hardly been mentioned is that man she was with was also gang-raped, and sentenced to 90 lashes as well. I don't know if he's been pardoned?
Dec 18 2007 16:47
#24
According to BBC, there's no word if he's been pardoned. ie he hasn't.
also according to BBC, the US refuses to condemn it at all. Maybe Moore's right, and it is indeed the Saudis not the Jews behind EVERYTHING.
Dec 18 2007 17:36
#25
Yeah Bob's right - it means he hasn't been. No news isn't good news in this instance. 
They obviously aren't "concerned" about his health - ie his plight hasn't attracted the same publicity.
Dec 21 2007 01:41
#26
Who cares? After all he's a man, probably did nothing to stop the situation and after all all men are...
Jan 8 2008 09:32
#27
Quote:
All men are rapists.
The idea that all men are rapists is a first wave feminist view expressed by many feminist sociologists. It Doesn't actualy mean that all men beat women into submission before forcing thier penis inside them and violating them without permission, it is based on the idea thatmen and women are unequal therefore any interaction between the two is based on a power difference which men exploit in order to have sex with women, the women consent to the sex but are unaware of the power inequality and the fact that they are simply sex to men.
Jan 8 2008 09:53
#28
anarcho-punk wrote:
Quote:
All men are rapists.The idea that all men are rapists is a first wave feminist view expressed by many feminist sociologists. It Doesn't actualy mean that all men beat women into submission before forcing thier penis inside them and violating them without permission, it is based on the idea thatmen and women are unequal therefore any interaction between the two is based on a power difference which men exploit in order to have sex with women, the women consent to the sex but are unaware of the power inequality and the fact that they are simply sex to men.
it's not a first wave feminist idea at all.
Jan 8 2008 09:55
#29
revol68 wrote:
it's not a first wave feminist idea at all.
Not that that matters, it's bollocks anyway.
Jan 8 2008 09:59
#30
John. wrote:
revol68 wrote:
it's not a first wave feminist idea at all.Not that that matters, it's bollocks anyway.
well it does because claiming such nonsense has a historical past Andrea Dworkin's fat arse or her pseudo leninist feminist mate MacKinnon's crude 'false conciousness' is granting it far too much credit. Afterall first wave feminism was about demanding equality with men, upholding the principle that woman are just as capable, rational and intelligent as men, whilst the Rad Fem shit reduces women to victims who are soo oppressed they can't even see it themselves.
I'll be expecting the press release from the First Lady supporting an American invasion of Saudi Arabia to save the women.