of course you shouldn't. They are your family. End of discussion!
Friendship/Family and Politics
Anarchism isn't a lifestyle choice, it's not something you affect on a personal level. It's about changing the fundamental basics of social organisation. In real terms, it doesn't matter what the fuck you do but they're your parents and they love you and they want the best for you so be grateful of their support!
I've had loads of rows with my parents about my politics. I've been doing so for over 30 years. They are still my mum and dad, nothing has ever changed that. Anyway I've got friends who aren't anarchists, though none who are fascists. I even manage to get on reasonably well with a neighbour who's in the filth.
I mean,
A cop might be OK in person, but I doubt you would ever feel comfortable around them knowing what they do everyday. I'm not sure it would be wrong, I just can't see that friendship working out.
And I don't think anyone at all wants to be friends with fascists, except the fascists. I don't think all of them are idiots, but they all believe immoral things. It's different from being friends with a small business owner. They are both enemies in theory but the small business owner is likely to be a good person who can be reasoned with when the revolution comes. There is usually only one way of dealing with fascists.
As for your folks, I agree with the others. You can't simply stop loving them , as for taking their financial support, you will have to decide how you feel about that.
But overall remember that no one chooses their class of birth, glad you chose anarchism and the struggle for a classless society!
knightrose wrote:
You can't choose your friends.
Family surely?
On a personal level I think I'd find it hard to spend any amount of time with a roz. I've had friends who have later turned out to have racist/quasi-fascist views (including one girl who was hugely involved in the antiwar walkouts at my college and I even managed to take to a Mayday demo in London once...in fact I'm convinced the latter played its part in her sudden conversion). I've challenged them to justify themselves and been firm about it. If you find the friendship breaks down cos of their opinions (as it did with this girl), then you probably weren't that good mates anyway.
yeah - meant family. As I said, it's friendly terms - not exactly drinking buddies! POassing pleasant comments when walking the dog, nodding and smiling, that sort of thing. Knowing he's not greatly enamoured with the job and is counting down the days till retirement helps, of course.
Again,
Just because you are a cop does not mean you go home every night and drown kittens.
But their job is always going to be opressive. When push comes to shove, everyone needs to choose a side. That's whats important. What side you will be on. Not to say that individual choices do not matter at all, but certainly I think the lifestylist left over emphasizes the value of the individual to the revolution.
Waving high to your cop neighbor is not what is keeping the state around.
Mike87 wrote:
Nonetheless I find it difficult to reconcile my anarchists beliefs with what my parents do. I am currently a student and my parents are helping me fund going to University, sometimes I feel like as an anarchist taking money that comes from a buisness (even if it is a small and more egalitarean buisness than most) is wrong.
In a capitalist society, exactly which money doesn't come from a business? Hell, it all ultimately comes from the state anyway, so it's not like it's been "tainted" by your parents' activities.
Mike87 wrote:
Are politics and friendship two completely seperate things that shouldnt effect each other? As an anarchist should you be friends with any1 u get along with regardless of their politics/relationship to the means of production? Or how about family, u dont choose them or what they do. Should an Anarchist son/daughter of say the owner of a major coorperation (to make a more extreme example) cut off links with his parents?
I've been friends with a strongly heterosexist monarchist for some time now. My parents are both avowed liberals (though I was happy to find out my dad was an anarchist some time back), and the rest of the family ranges from almost socialist to party-line Republicans. Politics isn't something we can expect to discuss without (sometimes heated) disagreement, but what's so special about that? Same goes for religion, philosophy, or favorite sports team. They're still friends (unless the disagreements are too much for the friendship) and family.
As for actually having friends/family who are class enemies, I think more than anything it just provides an opportunity for potentially constructive discussion. "Class enemy" doesn't mean you have to actively antagonize the person whenever you see them, unless you feel like being generally ineffective. Perhaps, though time and discussion, your parents could be convinced to reorganize the business as a workers' co-op or similar configuration? If nothing else, you are at least in position to be a permanent advocate for their workers, which is something.
i was always pretty lucky, my old man was a communist and i learned from an early age about politics and also given the freedom to make up my own mind as i grew older. but your parents may not agree with you but in the end they are your family and to cut them out of your life to make a pretty futile stand is stupid in my eyes.
Mike87 wrote:
Nonetheless I find it difficult to reconcile my anarchists beliefs with what my parents do. I am currently a student and my parents are helping me fund going to University, sometimes I feel like as an anarchist taking money that comes from a buisness (even if it is a small and more egalitarean buisness than most) is wrong.
Nah don't be silly, most parents who care about their kids are going to be giving them bits and bobs till they're at least 21 if not further and are gonna factor in the costs of helping kids out if they're at uni by sendng them a bit of cash now and then and doing shopping trips at tescos when they come up and see you or putting money towards driving lessons and so on. Both my grandparents helped both finance and time wise when me and my sister were born and my parents were in their late 20's and early 30's then, if your a tight knit family who look after each other then thats just what you do.
To be honest i think your somewhat demonising the idea of owning a business, its hardly the end of the world like. Also what your parents do for a living is their concern not yours, they're your family at the end of the day and cutting them out of your life because they aren't ''clear cut proles'' or something would just be ridiculous.
I think you are right to be conflicted, I have felt this way before. My thinking is:
As an anarchist, you obviously believe that everyone is capable of making sensible decisions if given the relevant information, and not unduly stressed by external constraints. You also believe (?) that the problem lies as much with our intuitions as our institutions.
Therefore, your environment is the perfect lab to analyse these factors, and try out techniques for revealing/ bypassing these problematic tendencies. Also, you should think about cultural relativity- the fact that people think the things they do because they honestly experience it that way. I always say, 'a change in culture must accompany a change in law; one without the other is a hard road'.
My dad continually moves to the right. My mom continually moves to the left. I can't have political discussions with my dad, but then, I never really did. My mom asks me tons of questions, reads my essays (and has loads more questions), asks my opinions. My dad's been a creep for as long as I can remember, while my mom has always thought of me as smart and able to communicate well.
Most of my co-workers are conservatives (even the ones who are for a stronger union at our job), many are homophobic despite a large presence of out queers on the job, and none (that I know of) are interested in anything more radical than Obama. Mostly I keep quiet, occasionally I make cracks about how stupid cops are (we deal with them every day, so it's a slow-moving target). That's about it. I save my politics for my friends.
i wish my parents owned a shop and had money, you will grow out of this in a few years
also chomsky describes himself as a conservative, that is a pretty vague term.
about 'sharing politics': people will listen to you if they respect you. never try to school someone older then you, and always listen first, talk second
you have nothing to feel guilty about. cutting off links with your family is highly unlikely to help emancipate the working class, and it will just make you and your family both miserable. same goes with friends.
it might be different if your family cut you out of their circle on the basis of your politics, but no real person is going to do this to their child unless they are a complete asswipe. if your politics cause friction in your family relationship, simply avoid the issue.
I've actually had some good friends who've had pretty reactionary views and who have been argued round because of the stupidity and emptiness of their prejudices. An anti-semitic Muslim mate in Bolton and a racist white friend for example. Don't write off your ability to change people's opinions if you know them well. But your parents don't sound politically reactionary as much as you're uncomfortable with their economic position. I wouldn't worry about it too much. They're hardly CEOs of Blackwater. I mean, if they were fucking workers around I'd have a word but thats not the case. Again, don't underestimate your own influence. But guilt is nothing to base political action on.
Black Badger wrote:
My dad continually moves to the right. My mom continually moves to the left. I can't have political discussions with my dad, but then, I never really did. My mom asks me tons of questions, reads my essays (and has loads more questions), asks my opinions. My dad's been a creep for as long as I can remember, while my mom has always thought of me as smart and able to communicate well.
Damn, punked again! Except that I think it's inverted; I find my mother intolerable for more than five minutes, while I can manage an entire evening with my dad. Why? My mom insists on talking politics and my dad knows not to. I probably should have mentioned that before.
"petty bourgeois" parents, eh? well, first of all, it's a little regimenting to categorize people wholesale with abstract concepts like that. since there's nothing but poverty at all levels in this civilization; it's silly to make up hierarchized distinctions. but as for them personally, if you don't end up with a civilized, mechanical existence in your own life, when you look back and finally untangle what you felt at this moment it'll probably have been pity for them. it's your social activity as a good communicator of your own individuality, not your parents' socioeconomic position, that will determine the kind of anarchy you live.
rich parents know perfectly well how much privilege immobilizes them. consider yourself lucky not to have parents that kick your ass or rape you or anything, but don't consider yourself disqualified from speaking from your own anarchist perspective on family hierarchy and the money system just because you may feel like a walking contradiction. after all, what human being isn't a walking contradiction in a civilization that must destroy nature and expand in order to survive, while the very principles of life itself are so contrary to that?
one way or another, though, I personally think that it's most fun to live your own life in total ignorance of any hierarchies, be completely yourself, and nurture your own nature. Revolutionary living and action require removing the blinkers of an ingrained respect for our parents' society, and at least some emotional distance from unchosen relationships of all kinds, including your relationship with the parents you happened to be born to. Every new generation is a new chance at life, and the people of every generation eventually must break with their parents and the world they occupy if we want instead to become the father/mother of our own inner child, our own free mind, our own anarchy.
Hi evry1 (1st post)
My parents are Petty Bourgeois. They run a relatively succesfull small Buisness and have some employees, although most arent paid a "wage" (its all done in percentages etc) but a couple are
They are liberal, leftish types although not revoluntionary and good people, I beleive, regardless of the fact they are still bosses. They argue its Ok to be a boss if u pay your workers well, treat them well etc and they hate big coorperations etc
Nonetheless I find it difficult to reconcile my anarchists beliefs with what my parents do. I am currently a student and my parents are helping me fund going to University, sometimes I feel like as an anarchist taking money that comes from a buisness (even if it is a small and more egalitarean buisness than most) is wrong.
I also have, beyond politics, a great relationship with my parnts, get on well love them very much etc but I suppose they are still technically a class enemy in terms of libetrian socialist thought, albeit less of an enemy than others.
Are politics and friendship two completely seperate things that shouldnt effect each other? As an anarchist should you be friends with any1 u get along with regardless of their politics/relationship to the means of production? Or how about family, u dont choose them or what they do. Should an Anarchist son/daughter of say the owner of a major coorperation (to make a more extreme example) cut off links with his parents?