Is the SPGB an anarchist organization?
Nov 8 2009 04:47
#32
Since some weary of my lengthy replies , and some simply don't take any notice of what is stated in them , preferring to repeat their own prejudices , i refer Trenchone to anarcho's earlier comment.
Quote:
No, they are Marxists. In fact, probably the closest Marxists to Marx and Engels in the UK. Key issue of difference is over fighting for reforms if a socialist gets elected. They reject it, arguing it would produce reformism. Marx and Engels advocated it and it did, as Bakunin predicted, produce reformism....
As discussed here, the SPGB agree with Marx and Engels that universal suffrage equates to the political power of the working class and that it can be used by socialists to capture the state, which would then be reformed to make it more democratic -- which would then quickly wither away...
In terms of goals, what they call socialism is pretty much communist-anarchism. They just disagree with anarchists on the best way to get there -- they support, as per Marx and Engels, "political action" (voting) while we support direct action.
A fair summary of the SPGB position.
Nov 8 2009 11:11
#33
Vlad336 wrote:
Entdinglichung wrote:
the SPGB is a contradiction in itself, an organisation which rejects every reform but also wants to achieve its revolution by a reform (through parliament) ... a strange flower which only could grow and develop under the relatively peaceful and non-repressive conditions of Britain around 1900That's a bit of an overstatement. Conditions in 1900 Britain were quite inhuman for a great deal of workers, as contemporary studies, like Rowntree's, show.
but unlike in e.g. Russia, they werent slaughtered while handing over a very moderate petition to the Czar, political repression in the Britain was much less severe than e.g. in Spain, Italy, Argentina, Ireland etc. ... and there was also the possibility to benefit from colonial exploitation or to become a white settler in a colony;
More like this
- The Role of the Soviets in Russia's Bourgeois Revolution - The Point of View of Julius Martov
- The Socialist Party of Great Britain - One Hundred Years - Red and Black Notes
- Leaflet: The Vote: A Blank Check for State Power
- Socialist Substandard: 100 years of the socialist party of 1904 - Paul Petard
- SPGB getting £166,000 in 3 months
"Once socialism ...has been established ... the State is dismantled." So this 'socialism' must presumably be a form of state socialism. And the capitalist state is a toothless moggy that will just be "disbanded" without a fight? As always the claims of the SPGB to be a marxist organisation fall down when it comes to the struggle between classes. For Marx and Engels "The history of all hitherto existing society is the history of class struggles". For the SPGB it's just a matter of turning people into 'socialists'.
A real revolution in social relations comes through the struggles of, ultimately, millions of workers. There's a battle for self-organisation and there's a battle for consciousness. These are not two separate things but part of the same process. An understanding that parliamentary illusions undermine the capacity of the working class to emancipate itself is just one of the many aspects of a growing class consciousness. It is as important as understanding that the working class needs to create its own means of struggle and destroy those institutions (like parliament) that only our capitalist exploiters can use.