subcultural kids
Jul 5 2007 14:54
ftony wrote:
Devrim wrote:
ftony wrote:
Jack wrote:
the majority of Wobs I've met has been a punk, or some variant. Overwhelmingly sound, but punks nonetheless.i've met one IWW punk. and she was more grunge than punk really.
If you can distinguish between grunge, and punk, you are by definition a 'subcultural kid'.
Devrim
Actually ftony, it was meant as neither a compliment, nor an insult, just a statement of fact.
I think that if we were picking up sub-cultural kids it would be an indication of the strength of the movement.
The reality is somewhat different though. Parts of the anarchist movement are in fact an subculture of a subculture.
I have no problem with young workers who are punks, or grunges. The problem comes when people try to present their politics as part of a subcultural milieu.
I had a long discussion about this with a comrade from our organisation after meeting some European anarchists.
Devrim
Jul 5 2007 15:03
#2
Mmm, it's not that hard to tell the difference between punk and grunge, the only major similarity they share is being mostly made up of young people who are non-specifically pissed off about things in general.
Jul 5 2007 15:08
#3
What about the shared sense of superiority over normals?
Jul 5 2007 15:09
#4
Yeah, grungers wear hoodies and baggy trousers, punks wear hoodies and tight trousers. But look shitter than emo and electro kids who also do.
And I thought kids now called grungers "greebos"?
Jul 5 2007 15:12
#5
John. wrote:
Yeah, grungers wear hoodies and baggy trousers, punks wear hoodies and tight trousers.
Don't forget the hair.
Grunge=Long and greasy
Punk=Big and spikey
Quote:
And I thought kids now called grungers "greebos"?
They're moshers over here. Though that's more of a general term for anybody who wears baggy clothes and listens to rock of any kind.
Jul 5 2007 15:14
#6
Devrim wrote:
I have no problem with young workers who are punks, or grunges. The problem comes when people try to present their politics as part of a subcultural milieu.
Seriously though, I don't think you'd find many people on here who'd disagree with this.
Jul 5 2007 15:15
#7
Goths and skins are the only subcultures worse than punk.
Jul 5 2007 15:15
#8
Alan wrote:
Whatever else you maybe discussing, unless you wanna classify being young and having a vague understanding of contemporary popular culture as "subcultural", then you're talking shit.
http://libcom.org/forums/thought/culture-libcom
Devrim
Jul 5 2007 15:23
#9
Hmmm no psytrancers are worse.
Jul 5 2007 15:26
#10
I dunno, Zobag is cooler than any goth I know.
Jul 5 2007 16:18
#11
And she never made you clean up any vomit
Jul 5 2007 16:28
#12
Jack wrote:
Goths and skins are the only subcultures worse than punk.
I think both goths and skins have better dress sense than punks. Actually, no. I think goth women and skin men have better dress sense than punks. Goth men and skin women, not so much. It's a shame there's no mod renaissance.
Jul 5 2007 16:31
#13
Which goth made me clean up vomit? 
Jul 5 2007 16:38
#14
Jack wrote:
Goths and skins are the only subcultures worse than punk.
Mix in blender, replace most guitars with electronics, add faux-military attire.
Jul 5 2007 16:44
#15
Jack wrote:
Goths and skins are the only subcultures worse than punk.
But....!
Jul 5 2007 18:27
#16
Grunge is surely dead now isn't it?
Jul 5 2007 18:43
#17
Jack wrote:
What about the shared sense of superiority over normals?
They're called chavs. Cos y'see, if you ain't a grunger, you're a chav. Or, if you live in Brighton, if you aren't a rich student, you're a chav (sorry, that should read "charv"...forgot to add Brighton Student Upspeak).
Jul 5 2007 18:48
#18
i more or less agree with op. want to make 2 further points
1 of course it doesn't mean that individual value systems/ethics [for want of a better word] should be steamrollered
2 massively surprised/upset [depending on how i feel] that modern anarchism can't deal with this. debord would be turning ion his grave, or something.
Jul 5 2007 18:52
#19
I think Devrim's stating the complete fuckin obvious. The only problem is that he appears to have little idea as to the criteria of a contemporary youth subculture.
Jul 5 2007 19:11
#20
so what's essential to being in a subculture?
Jul 5 2007 19:13
#21
cos 'listening to punk' is a retarded way of analyzing it 
eta more to the point - is it a bourgeois plot?
eta2: cos i've never met a subcultural anarchist myself, so i couldn't say. hey, maybe we could tie it into something to do with reformism - an ideology put before communism
Jul 5 2007 19:43
#22
don't say "sub-culture" say instead "commodity catergory" 
Jul 5 2007 20:06
#23
so anyone who puts commodities before communism? lazy rizer will be dissapointed 
Jul 5 2007 23:29
#24
i would just like to ask whether solfed don't like me cos they think me subcultrual?
1. i'm not
2. that's a pretty scary tendency tbh
Jul 6 2007 01:03
#25
Quote:
Devrim said:I have no problem with young workers who are punks, or grunges. The problem comes when people try to present their politics as part of a subcultural milieu.
I do. I'm burnt out on punk-rock poseurs -- especially those who wear all this anti-authority garb and then they want to go off and go to band practice instead of plan how to march on the boss.
For organizing purposes, go knock on someone's door with an Against Me shirt, a bullet belt, etc., and see where it gets you. (Perhaps the fashion sense is a bit different here. We're about 10-15 years behind New York, and I dunno about London - Mullets and NASCAR are big here).
Jul 6 2007 01:15
#26
Quote:
For organizing purposes, go knock on someone's door with an Against Me shirt, a bullet belt, etc., and see where it gets you.
Precisely. I got lambasted for saying just that (albeit with a tad more "high-minded" pomposity) on here a few years back, but it's 100% true.
Jul 6 2007 02:44
#27
Agreed. A friend of mine who is a wobbly won't wear hooded sweatshirts or band shirts or all black to IWW events for these reasons, trying to send a subtle message.
Jul 6 2007 03:04
#28
Kids get on my bus sometimes wearing Nirvana shirts and I silently chuckle while I think that I saw them play (they sucked BTW, Kurt was smacked off his head) before some of these kids were even born but I don't think there's much of a grunge subculture as such. I'm not sure there even was one when Pearl Jam, Nirvana et al were making multi-platinum albums.
Jul 6 2007 04:26
#29
I think that how you present yourself and communicate is way more important than what you wear. I'm not an evangelist, so I don't plan my wardrobe politically...
Anyway, I'm totally a subcultural kid, though I've never dressed like a punkrocker (always wanted to... just never cared enough to sew on patches or anything and would feel too silly).
Jul 6 2007 05:18
#30
I'm not an evangelist either, but I do sometime meet people who I've never met before who don't know much about the organization I'm part of or who are brand new members. Coming off as a subcultural ghetto or just as weird doesn't make those people comfortable or inspire confidence.
Pete, I saw Nirvana in 1994 and they were great. Jawbreaker was the opening band, they were phenomenal.
Whatever else you maybe discussing, unless you wanna classify being young and having a vague understanding of contemporary popular culture as "subcultural", then you're talking shit.