Maybe AF should reply to this?

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Chilli Sauce's picture
Chilli Sauce
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Jul 1 2011 07:00

Battlescarred, I personally and London SF as a whole has a great relationship with AF, but I've heard this criticism about not responding to emails as well. In fact, we've had contact from two individuals in the past 6 months, both of whom tried contact AF first and didn't get a response and then ended up contacting us. In one of the cases, I actually ended up contacted AF members directly for the person in question, but I'm still not sure he got a response. And that was here in London.

While I know that this going to come across as criticism, it's really only since SF has sorted out our new website that we've gotten our act together on this (and we're still working on this, tbh). We're in organisations without full-timers, so this shit's hard especially when we want to go out and do the fun, sexy stuff instead of boring adminny shit.

nastyned
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Jul 1 2011 07:24
akai wrote:

I don't see anything "delicate" about this situation

That's because you're in a position of ignorance.

nastyned
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Jul 1 2011 07:54

Do you know what email address they were using Chilli Sauce, as we certainly get a regular flow from the national email address?

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communal_pie
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Jul 1 2011 08:07

Well it's not just one or two people, but I know a bloke in HSG who just never received a reply after asking to join, this was in 2009. If you are saying you've sorted out email since then I have no reason to think you are wrong, but to be fair the questions posed in this thread were sent by email a couple of years ago anyway.

I am not suggesting that AF are a bad organisation and am not bashing it, I even qualifeid my post with "maybe that isn't everyone's experience", but you seem to have taken my post personally for some reason?

And it seems I'm not the only one who knows people, who've experienced problems with AF's communications on this thread either.

And it would make sense to have a few, well-maintained email addresses rather than lots of separate ones. I recall an af-north one for example, whereas people should be able to send it to single membership, enquiries ones etc.

ticking_fool
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Jul 1 2011 08:06

We have a lot of problems with stuff from national addresses getting caught in spam filters, particularly hotmail and older ISPs. I've ended up using several different email addresses to try and get hold of contacts that have followed up and I'm sure we've lost people who haven't seen replies and just thought bollocks to it.

All suggestions gratefully received on how to deal with that.

communal_pie's picture
communal_pie
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Jul 1 2011 08:18

It depends what e-mail software you are using and how its set-up. Presumably you will be using something like SpamAssassin? There is documentation available for customising it all over the web, http://spamassassin.apache.org/full/3.3.x/doc/Mail_SpamAssassin_Conf.html

This will generate a quick amnd handy config file for you: http://www.yrex.com/spam/spamconfig.php

Send test emails yourself to check its working and definitely cut down on the number of addresses you are using (why is organise ireland on hotmail? get it on the server asap!).

no1
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Jul 1 2011 08:21

Sometimes emails get lost because old (inactive) email addresses are still around (on websites or in print).

communal_pie's picture
communal_pie
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Jul 1 2011 08:46

I think I would have the addresses setup like so:

London & SE:
lseafed.org.uk

East/Anglia:
eastafed.org.uk

South west:
swafed.org.uk

Midlands:
midsafed.org.uk

North:
northafed.org.uk

Scotland: scotlandafed.org.uk

Ireland:
irelandafed.org[.ie?]

For consistency you should setup forwarders on all old email addresses so you don't miss anything, send it to the new replacement addresses and make sure that there are automatic replies saying the mail has been received and someone should reply shortly.

The idea of having loads of email addresses in places like east kent.. york etc, is all too much. At least this way you can send people to the right grouping, even if someone from Gloucester sends email to the mids or sw address it wouldn't matter too much since its based on geographical proximity to whatever group is closest anyway.

anarchistsolidarity
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Jul 1 2011 10:43

its funny how even the slightest criticism is considered "bashing". since when you guys are so sensitive? It is almost like there is big conspiracy out there to "bash the AF". There isn't.

Joseph Kay's picture
Joseph Kay
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Jul 1 2011 10:47
nastyned wrote:
Do you know what email address they were using Chilli Sauce, as we certainly get a regular flow from the national email address?

When SolFed was having this problem a couple of years ago we did the following:

- checked and tweaked spam filters
- set up a new national email address
- phased out the old one which had been posted publically, unbroken, and attracted lots of spam
- locally, we also have our email set up on peoples phones so we can respond quicker. Maybe buy your Nat Sec a cheap smartphone if they don't have one?

That let the National Secretary get on top of it. We've now spun out National Secretary (internal) and External Relations (external, duh) mandates as well, which helps spread the workload. If you have any old or alternate emails I'd make sure they're forwarding to the correct address too, as it might be people are finding an old email through google or something and it's not forwarding properly. Although in this specific case there was correspondance, this is re: the general claim of poor communications.

Revolutionary admin eh.

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888
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Jul 1 2011 18:20
anarchistsolidarity wrote:
its funny how even the slightest criticism is considered "bashing". since when you guys are so sensitive? It is almost like there is big conspiracy out there to "bash the AF". There isn't.

got to agree with this statement. people shouldn't be so sensitive.

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little_brother
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Jul 3 2011 13:35

Thanks for your input. Our current email set up reflects our organisational structure as a federation of groups with group secretaries that have defined responsibilities for dealing with contacts. Where we don't have a group, the join@ or info@ and (and wales@ scotland@) addresses are dealt with by designated communications officers in those regions (and Ireland contacts whether North or South are recommended to contact Organise! Ireland) - as per
http://www.afed.org.uk/organisation/contact.html
We don't have a regional structure as such (although some groups do meet regionally e.g. scotland) so we have not identified the need for a regional email set up.

We do forward defunct addresses to current ones. But if anyone has not had a reply recently and they can let us know what address they used by emailing our main address info@afed.org.uk that would be dandy. Other than this I don't think we have any immediate problems and much of what has been suggested we already have in place.
[Maybe this post and others could be moved out to a seperate thread to avoid too much digression?]

Battlescarred
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Jul 3 2011 19:23
communal_pie wrote:
Well it's not just one or two people, but I know a bloke in HSG who just never received a reply after asking to join, this was in 2009. If you are saying you've sorted out email since then I have no reason to think you are wrong, but to be fair the questions posed in this thread were sent by email a couple of years ago anyway.

I am not suggesting that AF are a bad organisation and am not bashing it, I even qualifeid my post with "maybe that isn't everyone's experience", but you seem to have taken my post personally for some reason?

And it seems I'm not the only one who knows people, who've experienced problems with AF's communications on this thread either.

And it would make sense to have a few, well-maintained email addresses rather than lots of separate ones. I recall an af-north one for example, whereas people should be able to send it to single membership, enquiries ones etc.

And "Also, AF are known to be disorganised in general, to say the least. Given all this, I am not surprised that they would find it hard to deal with the issues raised efficiently, never mind quickly."
And we are supposed to believe that this is not actually an attack on the AF, interspersed with "AF are known" etc an attack for which there is no actual evidence. Sorry but your nay saying doesn't really wash.

akai
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Jul 4 2011 00:06
Quote:
akai wrote:

I don't see anything "delicate" about this situation

Nasty Ned wrote:

That's because you're in a position of ignorance.

I wonder how I landed up in this supposed position of ignorance being I read the FAB statements, entries in forums, letters to other organizations AND we discussed this with them years ago. Which seems like a sort of normal thing to do if some organization you know publicly expresses their sympathies for somebody who was chasing after Roma with racist thugs.

Maybe instead of being defensive or calling people who did research the situation ignorant AF could just decide to read the same stuff the rest of us did and let us know if they have an opinion. Or not.

Serge Forward's picture
Serge Forward
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Jul 4 2011 09:05

Akai, try not to take the 'position of ignorance' comment personally. To one degree or another, we are all in a position of ignorance. The difference is, the AF will certainly be investigating the matter as thoroughly as it possibly can rather than making general off the cuff statements without properly checking the situation out first.

anarchistsolidarity
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Jul 4 2011 12:08

I just hope it will not take another 3 years... Would be also good to know what has been done investigation-wise so far.
and in the meantime I am just curious- are you still not going to support Jock in any way? Or are there any amongst you that perhaps also think that Jock was a crazed murderer that went to Bulgaria to kill people and should be locked up? Really, silence is not helping at all.

Serge Forward's picture
Serge Forward
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Jul 4 2011 14:09
anarchistsolidarity wrote:
I just hope it will not take another 3 years... Would be also good to know what has been done investigation-wise so far.
and in the meantime I am just curious- are you still not going to support Jock in any way? Or are there any amongst you that perhaps also think that Jock was a crazed murderer that went to Bulgaria to kill people and should be locked up? Really, silence is not helping at all.

Look, all I can personally say is, I don't know and I'm waiting for more info before making any comment. What I do know however, is that the AF will act honourably, whatever the findings.

anarchistsolidarity
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Jul 4 2011 14:12

ok, lets hope you are right.

communal_pie's picture
communal_pie
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Jul 4 2011 22:49
Quote:
Thanks for your input. Our current email set up reflects our organisational structure as a federation of groups with group secretaries that have defined responsibilities for dealing with contacts. Where we don't have a group, the join@ or info@ and (and wales@ scotland@) addresses are dealt with by designated communications officers in those regions (and Ireland contacts whether North or South are recommended to contact Organise! Ireland) - as per
http://www.afed.org.uk/organisation/contact.html
We don't have a regional structure as such (although some groups do meet regionally e.g. scotland) so we have not identified the need for a regional email set up.

We do forward defunct addresses to current ones. But if anyone has not had a reply recently and they can let us know what address they used by emailing our main address info@afed.org.uk that would be dandy. Other than this I don't think we have any immediate problems and much of what has been suggested we already have in place.
[Maybe this post and others could be moved out to a seperate thread to avoid too much digression?]

That sounds alright, just make sure the spam filters are working properly and also get organise! ireland off of yahoo mail, thats godawful, it was down for a few days about 2 weeks ago..

Battlescarred wrote:
And "Also, AF are known to be disorganised in general, to say the least. Given all this, I am not surprised that they would find it hard to deal with the issues raised efficiently, never mind quickly."
And we are supposed to believe that this is not actually an attack on the AF, interspersed with "AF are known" etc an attack for which there is no actual evidence. Sorry but your nay saying doesn't really wash.

Err, I don't care what you think? And it seems other people who are evidently in - or linked to - AF don't find my messages provocative, so don't include me in your ego-crusade. I have no problem with AF and wish them well as an organisation, they are internationalist, good people and do a lot of good in general fior the anarchist movement in this country. No organisation is perfect.

radicalgraffiti
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Jul 5 2011 10:18

organise! ireland are a completely separate organisation.

I'm not sure but i think we often have problems with our mail getting caught in other peoples spam filters, rather than the other way round, although that may happen to

and yes like Battlescarred i found your message rude, but im not replying to it because its stupid

communal_pie's picture
communal_pie
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Jul 5 2011 16:36

O! I have a lot of links to AFed, why would they be mentioned on your contacts page if they were completely separate?

If you have problems with popular email clients and their spam filter settings, experiment a bit until you get the right settings (also make sure your mail server is NOT sending from a generic mail server address, make sure it is sending from the official addresses).

If you found my post rude then let me be more clear - you shouldn't because it's not meant to be rude, it's harsh but true and quite frankly, I was going to tone it down a little bit but no, I don't think any part of it was unfair.

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Joseph Kay
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Jul 5 2011 16:39
communal_pie wrote:
O! I have a lot of links to AFed, why would they be mentioned on your contacts page if they were completely separate?

Organise! was formed by a merger between an AF group and an anarcho-syndicalist one, so there's a historical link as well as current fraternal relations.

MT
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Jul 5 2011 17:38

I quite don't understand AF "investigating" because when Czech sister organization of FAB (CSAF) contacted FAB in June 2011, they got reply within few days. And the reply is basically the same as was explained by anarchistsolidarity (and Devrim, no matter what you think about google translator, you are badly wrong here, cos the translation on anarchistsolidarity website is almost perfect) - Jock was a soldier who does not deserve support, plus FAB confirmed that they showed public condolence to the family of the death racist guy.

There is NOTHING to investigate, the facts are absolutely obvious. I can imagine AF is ashamed of being in IAF with organisations with positions like FAB, but let's not hide it with "investigation", please.

anarchistsolidarity
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Jul 5 2011 18:44

hm.. interesting..

Serge Forward's picture
Serge Forward
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Jul 5 2011 19:58
MT wrote:
There is NOTHING to investigate

Hmm... a comment like that says a lot about your definition of justice. I can't claim to know much about this case but you seem to know even less yet still find it easy to make such judgements on minimal information.

MT
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Jul 5 2011 20:00

you know shit about what i know, so stop making stupid comments...

Serge Forward's picture
Serge Forward
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Jul 5 2011 20:08

Well, I already know that your 'nothing to investigate' approach doesn't bode well for any kind of revolutionary justice.

MT
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Jul 5 2011 20:11

i am so sorry to fail your test

Serge Forward's picture
Serge Forward
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Jul 5 2011 20:22

Apology accepted wink Seriously, as I understand it (and admittedly, that's not much), this whole thing doesn't actually strike me as simple as some people are making it out to be. So on that basis, I think it is worth investigating.

Anyway, I do wish people should wait for the AF or the IFA to come back on this rather than speculating or trying to pre-empt whatever those organisations are going to say about it.

anarchistsolidarity
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Jul 5 2011 20:54

simple statement such as "we contacted FAB and are waiting for what they have to say about it" could have really helped though, don't you think? Instead we are getting really prolonged silence.

To be honest though, personally to me and others connected with AS it is very straighght and simple question ,that we asked on the beginning of the statement- which side are you on? Seems like lots of people are not willing to say..