Boulcolonialboy is leaving libcom

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Tacks's picture
Tacks
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Sep 9 2008 15:39
Boulcolonialboy wrote:
Hey, its been interesting and good while it lasted but I am leaving the libcom discussion forums. I'll continue to use the website and upload stuff when I have time but basically the forums have gone to the fuckin dogs lately.

Of course there are probably those who will blame revol68 on that but thats shite. There is just an amazing amount of crap on here that should have been deleted as close to as soon as it was posted as possible. There is also shit being posted on here that should get some people a kicking.
Really folks sort the admin or close the forums - its got that fucking bad.

Again thanks for the last few years.

fair play boul.

I already sort of have left libcom, after years of trying to placate people on here i have realised a) they don't matter IRL, b) they aren't even that interesting. The atmosphere is poisonous, where 'having a laugh' has come to mean people are afraid to post about what they are doing or thinking about because it will get ripped apart and be used against them personally in other discussions. This is actually spilling over into real life, its causing genuine grief. Indeed it already has, for years.

All the orgs listed here that i know have their own discussion boards off site now, when the AF left i stopped posting regularly, and kept that up - only started posting again after putting up the IWW party advert a week ago. Posting here made me really negative and badly affected my positivity in terms of what was politicvally a good idea or possible. Being off here was great for getting loads of stuff done and realising lots more people were sound comrades than i'd been lead to believe.

And its not a moderation policy, this is not really a judgement on the mods - its an attitude on the forums. I'm certainly not innoccent of having a laugh to the point of being very rude to people, but i'm FUCKING MILES away from doing some of the shit people on here have done. Forwarding personal PMs, making fun of people's families.... Fuck, yesterday i got a PM from a prominent dickhead here asking for personal details of another poster i knew so they could make fun of them! When someone thinks its OK to ask something like that, you have to despair for this place.

All that is left here in terms of community is a group of maximum 12 ppl talking to each other about fuck all, certainly not politics anyway. Congratulating themselves on being normal enough to have gone out for a drink at the weekend or having bought some new clothes.

The other forums are good and you still get the best theoretical discussion here, though it feels like there a lot less being posted there and news artcles have slowed to trickle.

So, nice one boul , good on you smile

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Sep 9 2008 15:41
Quote:
It is rather worrying that libcommunity gets more posts than all the other forums. Is libcom a social networking site?

It is, a very poor one, for a very, very small group of people.

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Tacks
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Sep 9 2008 15:49
Jack wrote:
You can mention me by name, you cowardly little shit. lol how out of order asking who someone was on libcom to take the piss out of them.

well you've named yourself now haven't you. And its not cowardice, it's an ounce of respect for people's personal privacy, its a tiny, weeny bit of decency so alien to you when you're in front of a keyboard.

....which is why i just deleted a paragraph of personal abuse smile

I brought up what you said as an indication of how people like to personalise what should be political arguments and give out abuse here, maintaining your anonymity; you immiediately identify yourself and call me a cowardly little shit - a perfect indication of how people like to personalise what should be political arguments and give out abuse here.

I don't talk to you IRL, i won't talk to you here. Have a nice life.

Mike Harman
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Sep 9 2008 16:14

NIce to see such a high level of discussion in a thread about why someone's leaving due to the low level of discussion.

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Tree
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Sep 9 2008 16:36

It's a bit much to say Libcommunity should be deleted, but there are some things I've seen which definitely shouldn't have been posted. I enjoy going over the theory debates and sometimes it's best for me to stay out of something I don't think I can add to but only learn from. Libcommunity is just a way to express yourself without being serious and relieve a bit of boredom. Someone mentioned that it turns people away when they see Libcommunity. As a newcomer I think I'd be more put off by people not having a sense of fun or humour and engaging in nothing but serious discussion. While I appreciate the main purpose of the site I still think Libcommunity deserves a place on it and would obviously agree it should remain a small part of the forums.

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Sep 9 2008 16:37

Well the platform is pretty tasty, tbf.
My two cents: there's no need to delete libcommunity, some people (e.g. juozokas yesterday) have crossed the line by lightyears, but overall I think the joking is fairly harmless and where it's politically incorrect it's usually very easy to spot the irony. Hiding it from unregistered users would solve the problem of passers-by being put off by it due to thinking it's more serious than it is, and taking it off the tracker would solve the problem of registered users who don't find it amusing being irritated by it. Which is fair enough really, it's not everyone's cup of tea.
As far as personal insults/making fun of people's families/being a knob to people IRL based on stuff here is concerned, I don't think that's on, but I also don't think it's a reason to delete the forum. As with the non-PC stuff, people would just end up plaguing the political/serious sections of the forum with it.

Er, having read this back I have basically just agreed with plenty of other people and have added nothing to this discussion. Never mind eh. neutral

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Sep 9 2008 16:44

I am immature and a dickhead and I crossed the line and should be banned for 2 weeks or something. Don't delete libcommunity!

dee
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Sep 9 2008 16:55
Tree wrote:
It's a bit much to say Libcommunity should be deleted, but there are some things I've seen which definitely shouldn't have been posted. I enjoy going over the theory debates and sometimes it's best for me to stay out of something I don't think I can add to but only learn from. Libcommunity is just a way to express yourself without being serious and relieve a bit of boredom. While I appreciate the main purpose of the site I still think Libcommunity deserves a place on it and would obviously agree it should remain a small part of the forums.

Agree with Jenni and Tree.

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Sep 9 2008 17:03

This has been said before, but I think there needs to be more moderation on the forums. I realise they are not always available to do this and have busy lives themselves. Perhaps more moderators are required.

akai
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Sep 9 2008 17:04

I read this site from time to time, but perhaps not as frequently as some here seem to do. To tell the truth, only now I looked at libcommunity; chit chat and misc. topics are generally not interesting for me, although I understand that some people may appreciate it. The level is pretty pathetic, at least in my opinion; I don't know why people bother. That said, I read this sight very selectively but have no idea if most readers are the same or if most readers have started using this as their little buddy community. Some people have said, if you don't like it, don't read it and I agree with this. However, a couple of ideas:

1. If libcomunity is not a priority, maybe it could go somewhere "more discreet" and be off the tracker. In general, when somebody first comes to the sight, it is difficult to figure out and requires a lot of time to look through all the forum categories. Perhaps I am not patient, but it's quite a lot. For me personally, I would prefer having the most important things first, and I don't consider things like the bin to be something I wanna look at. On the other hand, some things are placed low and underused; perhaps their is a correlation. (Perhaps not, just an idea.)

2. We have to realize that the definition of "crap" is going to be very different for different people. People have complained about crap spilling into to forums. Again, I tend to read selectively, so I just ignore what seems on the surface to be uninteresting, however maybe somebody has a different assessment. You can basically break crap down into types: posts with more social banter than political content; politically ridiculous or misplaced theory and discussion; flames and critical discussions which center on abuse rather than constructive discussion.

People react quite differently to these types of material and have different levels of tolerance for them. Some people are very quickly turned off for example by internal discussions like the IWW paper funds, whereas some (myself included) don't care much, as long as people are speaking about legitimate issues, not just name-calling. So whenever anybody complains about "crap" I'm not sure we have the same definition.

There was the idea to elicit some feedback on a site whose collective I am on and I really saw that some readers are on a completely different planet than others. Which leads me to a suggestion which might be interesting, if the collective feels it makes any sense. You could set up a feedback questionnaire (which doesn't need to be anonymous) which can invite readers to answer some questions about the content of the site and to send comments. In particular, you could ask people what kind of things they dislike or consider to be crap, even sending links to examples. If a large number of respondants are annoyed by a certain kind of post, it could be pointed out.

I think that of course the editorial collective may feel they are good judges of this, but if some people are saying that the delete key needs to be hit more often, the most ardent readers and users of these forums should have some clearer imput on what kinds of things should be deleted and this should be spelled out to the users.

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Sep 9 2008 17:11

Libcommunity is off the tracker.

It wont be deleted, so stop talking about that now wink

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Sep 9 2008 17:20
Tacks wrote:
fair play boul.

I already sort of have left libcom, after years of trying to placate people on here i have realised a) they don't matter IRL, b) they aren't even that interesting. The atmosphere is poisonous, where 'having a laugh' has come to mean people are afraid to post about what they are doing or thinking about because it will get ripped apart and be used against them personally in other discussions. This is actually spilling over into real life, its causing genuine grief. Indeed it already has, for years.

All the orgs listed here that i know have their own discussion boards off site now, when the AF left i stopped posting regularly, and kept that up - only started posting again after putting up the IWW party advert a week ago. Posting here made me really negative and badly affected my positivity in terms of what was politicvally a good idea or possible. Being off here was great for getting loads of stuff done and realising lots more people were sound comrades than i'd been lead to believe.

And its not a moderation policy, this is not really a judgement on the mods - its an attitude on the forums. I'm certainly not innoccent of having a laugh to the point of being very rude to people, but i'm FUCKING MILES away from doing some of the shit people on here have done. Forwarding personal PMs, making fun of people's families.... Fuck, yesterday i got a PM from a prominent dickhead here asking for personal details of another poster i knew so they could make fun of them! When someone thinks its OK to ask something like that, you have to despair for this place.

All that is left here in terms of community is a group of maximum 12 ppl talking to each other about fuck all, certainly not politics anyway. Congratulating themselves on being normal enough to have gone out for a drink at the weekend or having bought some new clothes.

The other forums are good and you still get the best theoretical discussion here, though it feels like there a lot less being posted there and news artcles have slowed to trickle.

So, nice one boul , good on you smile

oh fuck off you spineless wee cunt - if you're so arse-lickingly congradulatory toward Boul why didn't you fuck off months ago or say something
god I hate arselicks
you easily contributed to plenty of shitty daft threads and were in on plenty of injokes
sure, you aren't party to current ones but this fuckin knee-jerk pathetic bandwagon jumping is way worse than the twats who can't do irony properly.

Seriously, February, the thread I mentioned, there seemed to be a general agreement that libcommunity should be off-tracker.
Also making it only viewable by registered users makes lots of sense.
It would stop the stupid twats who lurk for ages and post nothing on any other discussions, follow injokes for months, then try to jump in on jokes that require a little bit of nuance or wit to follow and participate in, and end up making dicks of themselves.

radicalgraffiti
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Sep 9 2008 17:43

would it also be possible to hide libcommunity from the search function?

Mike Harman
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Sep 9 2008 17:45
rakan wrote:
Libcommunity is off the tracker.

Where was juozukas' transgression?

Mike Harman
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Sep 9 2008 17:47
radicalgraffiti wrote:
would it also be possible to hide libcommunity from the search function?

Yes, but I don't want to do this until after we upgrade to D6 since it's got performance implications.

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Sep 9 2008 17:51
revol68 wrote:
Quote:
Congratulating themselves on being normal enough to have gone out for a drink at the weekend or having bought some new clothes.

He has a point with this though conor.

christ that's not why Boul left though, and while that may true it is hardly responsible for the apparent crisis all this hysterical bollocks is talking about
I mean literally, someone going on about their clothes is beyond harmless

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Sep 9 2008 18:08
Mike Harman wrote:
rakan wrote:
Libcommunity is off the tracker.

Where was juozukas' transgression?

???

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Sep 9 2008 18:26
revol68 wrote:

No but it's typical of the utterly inane shite that has swamped libcommunity, alot of peoples complaints aren't about something in itself being harmful but rather a build up of inane bollox, of which wanking on about going out as if it's a new discovery is an apt example. There seems to be a rather pathetic need for people to assert how 'normal' they are (that goes way beyond a criticism of activist/militant crap), either by banging on about how they went drinking at the weekend, what clothes they bought, or constantly having to prove their edgy un PC humour. It's the relentless monotony of it that is the problem, not any one part of it in general, infact taken by themselves there is no problem with any of those things per se, but when it's part of this transparent sad attempt at constructing some normal, laddier than laddish, identity and culture it suddenly turns a bit Alan Partridge but without the laughs.

sorry but this is wank
yes lots of the jokes are a bit boring and tired, but if there's such a consensus to that effect, which all these apparent kneejerk bandwagon jumpers seem to be asserting there is, why the fuck not start some interesting discussions?

I mean really, if no one talks about science or religion, i start threads myself and don't piss an moan when people talk about stuff I'm not interested in.

While it's fair to say that a lot of shite was talked, it's cowardly as fuck to pretend that you weren't party to it, and those that are stepping back and saying 'oh well I never said it as much' are really just spineless cunts, who apprently had no problem sitting lurking reading the threads but all of a sudden in the space of a day have developed some phobia to that section.

Again, this was all talked about 7 months ago in the previous thread, and a ton pof people have started posting since then, on libcommunity, who overnight have had a sudden turn of heart. Wise the fuck up kids.

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Sep 9 2008 18:28
Jack wrote:
revol68 wrote:
No but it's typical of the utterly inane shite that has swamped libcommunity, alot of peoples complaints aren't about something in itself being harmful but rather a build up of inane bollox, of which wanking on about going out as if it's a new discovery is an apt example. There seems to be a rather pathetic need for people to assert how 'normal' they are (that goes way beyond a criticism of activist/militant crap), either by banging on about how they went drinking at the weekend, what clothes they bought

Weelers does this every now and then, but it's hardly a constant theme. confused

I mean there is plenty wrong, but it's not like this is all over the place.

yeah that post is utter utter bollocks, revol has posted just as much stuff over the years about stupid nights out he's gone on, trips to Ikea and various inane shite about the last TV show her watched, basically, he is pretending he's agrown up and being a wanker about stuff he apparently thinks is beneath him now
earnest bollocks

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Sep 9 2008 18:59

Libcommunity is for the off-topic chit chat, though, isn't it? Every forum will have cliquey in-jokes and shit, especially when a lot of the posters know each other IRL. I don't think it's as tragic as revol68 makes out, but on occasion a line has been crossed (and I don't exclude myself from this).

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Sep 9 2008 19:04

I don't particularly see you being bored of Libcommunity as problem. tongue Why don't you start some interesting threads? wink

Pepe
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Sep 9 2008 19:11

There's a thread complaining about people being mean to each other on the internets every 6 months here, though they usually ask for revol to be banned.

I don't think there's anything wrong with libcommunity. I think it's lulz. However I think that the jokey attitudes that are acceptable there often spill into other areas of the forum, now that libcommunity's off the tracker the dictinction will be clearer and the lulz will stay in their rightful place.

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Sep 9 2008 19:15

Libcommunity was set up to keep crap off the real threads and to provide a place for the more social side of libcom and keep the serious threads free of it.
It shouldn't have been on the tracker and I thought catch had taken it off ( I never use the tracker myself) but there were performance issues at the time I think.
Libcommunity is a pile of shit and has probably gone a bit too far, and it is spilling out into other threads, especially news threads. If people just come here to fuck about on libcommunity then they are going to post inane shit on other threads too when libcommunity is too slow.

Not that I don't do a fair amount of this myself. I gave up on the politics threads a while ago because they were either endless rehashes of the same arguments or above my head. I mostly gave up on news threads because it was slow and there wasn;t a lot of discussion. I'm not sure libcommunity has a negative effect in that I think I stopped contributing to the site before I started posting so much bollocks.

Basically libcom should not really be a place where people come just to fuck about there are shitloads of other forums. There are a few newer posters on here who have said that they like libcommunity and it provides a break from the more serious threads, as long as it does that then we should be fine. There shouldn't need to be heavy modding. If posters can't control themselves then either other posters can let an admin know (probably via admin@libcom but maybe ask one of them first before you start mailing) either that or we can use the feedback forum (although that could easily descend into flaming) or we could get back the report post button.

As long as libcommunity is not negatively affecting the aims and objectives of the site then there shouldn't be a problem. Dropping it down to by the bin can be helpful but if people ignore it totally then it will become useless as a community part of the forum and new posters won't use it and it will be the same as it is now. The bigger problem libcom faces is if the quality of political discussion is too low (I'm not certain that it is, I've given up on the politics threads). Personally I had a lot of interesting discussions with real life comrades and although I've considered continuing them on here or asking other questions I really don't see this as a place where I can do that. I don't know if that is just me though.

On the whole libcom requires more effort on the part of its posters.

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Sep 9 2008 19:25

Basically Revol is pissing and moaning cos HE doesn't like the joke anymore, boo fucking hoo.
Sure jokes get stale, and idiots that lack a sense of wit go way to far. Personally I've made a point of saying to people when sick shit isn't funny, like the Downs jokes and what not. No ones taking offense that you;re saying jokes are old, that;s fine.

It's the earnest moralism dripping form all your posts about stuff like this and the condescending 'pah, that's so 3 yrs ago' you seem to be dishing out to others. In and of itslef that's fine, but you seem to be using it as a reason why those discussions shouldn't be taking place, which is bollocks/.

Given that in UK anarchism you are probably single-handedly the most notorious user for shutting down discussion on these boards over the last 4yrs and the fact that I can name specific individuals who don't post here because of you, I personally think it's pretty rich and to be honest uncharacteristically spineless of you to be talking some of the shite you are on here.

Seriously, how is someone going on about some shite clothes they bought any different from you telling everyone you just went to Ikea?
Cop-on.

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Sep 9 2008 19:35
revol68 wrote:

No but it's typical of the utterly inane shite that has swamped libcommunity, alot of peoples complaints aren't about something in itself being harmful but rather a build up of inane bollox, of which wanking on about going out as if it's a new discovery is an apt example. There seems to be a rather pathetic need for people to assert how 'normal' they are

you mean like posting about how you just bought a desk in ikea?

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Sep 9 2008 19:37
jef costello wrote:

On the whole libcom requires more effort on the part of its posters.

exactly, instead of people pissing and moaning that it isn't 'interesting' enough to them, despite the fact they don't actually even attempt to start discussions themselves

yuda
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Sep 9 2008 20:09

If the mods here don't have the time to admin libcommunity why don't the set up some guidelines for posting in that forum then make a bunch of people moderators just on libcommunity. Natural selection will weed out the mods who abuse their mod power and those who don't. Worked reasonably well for both flag.blackened.net and slashdot.

Then we might at least get some interesting off topic banter

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Sep 9 2008 23:06
revol68 wrote:
also even if I hadn't said something in the past about this (I did though) it's hardly unknown for someone to change their attitude to something, to think it's gone to far or to just get bored with it, it hardly invalidates their opinion.

nor does it mean anyone should pay a blind bit of notice to any of the pathetic fake-redemption shite you are talking

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Sep 9 2008 23:16
revol68 wrote:
Way to miss the point.

The complaints about libcommunity are not the same ones as those bandied about at me in the past, they aren't about people being mean to each other in discussions or not respecting some imagined commonality of comradeship despite divergent politics, that's an entirely different matter as you well know and one that is patently bullshit considering more people stormed off after I went some way in trying to amend my behaviour (not out of some change of character as so much as I was getting fed up with people using swear words as an excuse not to engage with the point). I fail to see why you are bringing this up, especially in the light of many people making the complaints about libcommunity specifically stating it isn't about me, infact Ret Marut pointed out that at least when I was abusive it contained something of an argument. The argument isn't about people being abused or personally offended, so much as put off by the inanity of it.

Your point about my post about a desk overlooks the fact that explicitly stated that the problem isn't this or that particular post but a general culture, it's hardly a problem if someone posts about say getting a new bike, computer or whatever, it's how it relates to this general ironic consumerism, racism and conservatism that has gotten well old. Your claim that this is just me jumping on some bandwagon all of a sudden is bollox, you know me and boul were saying this months ago, infact we joked that you and weeler had broke libcom, so don't claim it is spineless or whatever.

It's not missing the point, I know what your argument is, I just think it's a piss-poor veil for the fact that you single handedly drove more people away from using this site than anyone else, but for some reason thinks your reasons for doing it were better than just posting 'daft shite'

Seriously drop this bollocks finger pointing. 'Oh it's just a general culture not any one thing' but all your examples are pretty specific and on that basis you've contributed to the supposed farce just as much as anyone else.

Your overnight old-man of anarchism shit is pretty pathetic. Right we get it, you think it's boring, fuck off then.

I never claimed you were jumping on a bandwagon - re-read my post please. I know you been pissing and moaning about this stuff for ages, and I believe there's a thread from about 6 mths ago where I suggested you start some thread if you don't like the 'quality of discussion' as opposed to waiting for other people to start them and either:
a - whinging when they are 'too boring' for you
b - abusing people when actual discussions start

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Sep 9 2008 23:19
revol68 wrote:
redemption for what purposes? like seriously, why would I bother looking to start some PR offensive now? sure other people have explicitly said that this issue is different from issues about me in the past, as such my attitude towards this changes nothing around previous issues.

anyway are you going to deny that I made similar criticism quite a few months ago, are you denying that me and boul joked about you and weeler breaking libcom?

I don't know where I supposedly denied this.
As for Boul he easily contributed to as many of the shit threads, random abuse, and crap memes as anyone else so it'd be a tad rich.

Ask anyone around the UK anarchist milieu why they left libcom, they will say Revol68, not someone posting about their clothes.
I actually defended you and still will but i think it's rich as fuck of you to start claiming the blame lies with others.

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