benefits and London bombers

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bugrey
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Jul 29 2005 18:56
benefits and London bombers

i was wondering what anyone thinks about the references to the amount of benefits given to the attempted bombers from last thursday (dunno whether they did that for the '7/7' bombers).

i would say that maybe that their doing it because these people are from the bottom end of society and this position has 'driven them to it', or at least encouraged it in some way. Then i remember all the all those people who go on about the "bloody imigrants" who are stealing all of our jobs/benefits/housing/whatever (normally old retired people or young unemployed people) and i think that they would probably be encouraging these views

as i said i was just wondering what other people thought about it...

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PaulMarsh
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Jul 29 2005 20:19

The benefits mentioned were actually pretty standard - housing benefit on a tower block council flat for several years. Equally that money would never have been in the suspects hands - it would have been moved from one council department to another. I can't get excited about it.

I do have a problem with the claim that one of the bomb suspects was allowed to become a British citizen AFTER he was convicted of several muggings. If you are going to have any immigration controls, you may as well use them, at least occasionally, to actually keep out the odd anti-social criminal.

Unless there were incredibly extenuating circumstances, I can't really see why the authorities did not despatch him elsewhere.

Deezer
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Jul 29 2005 20:37

bugrey you seriously have to ask whether its a case of people encouraging these views or these views being encouraged by the media & governnment.

Paul, I'd have thought that you'd be the last person to use media claims (whether they're true or not) to re-inforce what is after all anti-immigrant propaganda. This is exactly the type of sentiment the government are happy to see heightened off the back of the London bombings.

Scroungers, muggers, terrorists - fuck sounds just like the 'oirish' - wise up

roll eyes

circle A red n black star

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JDMF
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Jul 30 2005 08:35
PaulMarsh wrote:
If you are going to have any immigration controls, you may as well use them, at least occasionally, to actually keep out the odd anti-social criminal.

Unless there were incredibly extenuating circumstances, I can't really see why the authorities did not despatch him elsewhere.

so others should worry about him? The problem would not disappear, just move to another country... And for anarchist, does it make any difference in which country some anti-social dude is in?

redyred
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Joined: 20-02-04
Jul 30 2005 10:47
PaulMarsh wrote:
If you are going to have any immigration controls, you may as well use them, at least occasionally, to actually keep out the odd anti-social criminal.

We've got plenty of anti-social criminals who were born and bred here. Would you deport them as well or find other solutions to the problem?

RedCelt
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Joined: 17-06-05
Jul 30 2005 12:50
Boulcolonialboy wrote:
bugrey you seriously have to ask whether its a case of people encouraging these views or these views being encouraged by the media & governnment.

Paul, I'd have thought that you'd be the last person to use media claims (whether they're true or not) to re-inforce what is after all anti-immigrant propaganda. This is exactly the type of sentiment the government are happy to see heightened off the back of the London bombings.

Scroungers, muggers, terrorists - fuck sounds just like the 'oirish' - wise up

roll eyes

circle A red n black star

Well, anyone whose on benefits is a scrounger to The Sun. Like you say we've heard it all before.

red n black star

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PaulMarsh
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Jul 31 2005 08:22

What I am saying is that if someone is given a stamp in their passport saying they have permission to stay here for a set time, and that getting permanent leave to remain is dependent on their good character (which it is under current rules) and that person goes out and commits a series of muggings and is jailed for them, I have no problem with that person not getting permanent leave to remain.

I think this may be case where 5% of the anarchist movement agrees with me, but 99% of working class people agree with me.

Oh well.

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JDMF
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Jul 31 2005 09:18

i guess we get the "how should the system work now under current rules and regulations" and "how should it be done" mixed up here.

But actually I still think the deportations based on breaking the law are really really repressive and i oppose them even if it does let some of these arseholes through in the process because it is the prime reason why migrants do not get well organised and fight back against the abusive system, that is, they are afraid of being deported if something goes wrong or police comes up with some bullshit story.

probably not 99% Paul, since there are more immigrants already than 1% wink But i give you 95% - just goes to show there is a lot of work to do grin