Help with new libcom feature - the "revolutionary wave"

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Joseph Kay
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Sep 11 2007 20:13

nice work catch, i've been hectic but i'll try and help out with this when i get the chance - next week at the latest.

sphinx
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Sep 12 2007 14:43
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I know it’s slightly off topic, but I did not want to start a new thread.

I have read somewhere that during the Germany in the early 1920s, the Nazis and the KPD sometimes shared the stage together at meetings. They both supported attacking Jewish “finance capital”. I cannot remember where I read this (it wasn’t from some far-right conspiracy website though. It may well have been from an article or a book from libcom.

Does anybody know anything about this?

A very in-depth study of this phenomenon.

From ‘Judas’ to ‘Jewish Capital’: Antisemitic Forms of Thought in the German Communist Party (KPD) in the Weimar Republic, 1918-1933 - Olaf Kistenmacher

http://www.engageonline.org.uk/journal/index.php?journal_id=10&article_id=35

bastarx
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Sep 13 2007 03:02
martinh wrote:
Don't have time to add lots, but there's a couple of glaring omissions from the "revolutionary wave", namely Italy & Hungary, both of which has enormous revolutionary tumult at the time. I think there's a lot more revolutionary activity in central and eastern Europe we just don't have a lot of material about from the same period.
Worth explicitly linking in the late WW1 mutinies across the board I'd reckon.
The repression of the Australian IWW was also explicitly linked to the first world war, and its role in the successful anti-conscription referendum, though this may fall outside the scope, it's always worth flagging up.

Regards,

Martin

Yeah the Oz IWW was effectively repressed in 1917 with mass jailings which a lot of them didn't really fight - the old 'filling the jails' thing which might have worked in tiny US lumber towns but not so well in Sydney which meant that when the NSW general strike (really a mass strike) started lots of the best worker militants were off the scene. Also some non-citizen wobs were simply put on the next ship leaving Oz.

Mike Harman
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Sep 13 2007 09:54
Peter wrote:
Yeah the Oz IWW was effectively repressed in 1917 with mass jailings which a lot of them didn't really fight - the old 'filling the jails' thing which might have worked in tiny US lumber towns but not so well in Sydney which meant that when the NSW general strike (really a mass strike) started lots of the best worker militants were off the scene. Also some non-citizen wobs were simply put on the next ship leaving Oz.

Was that you offering to write something up on the New South Wales general strike? Thanks Pete wink

This is all I can find on the 'net sad
http://www.takver.com/history/myunion/myunionapp07.htm
http://www.records.nsw.gov.au/archives/general_strike_of_1917_12707.asp

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Sep 14 2007 01:02

yeah, looks good mate. Just a few bits

Quote:
it's context within the period 1905-1926 when revolution

Is this meant to be 1915-1926? Are you gonna add date qualifiers to the 'revolutionary wave' feature? Just reckon it might be interesting to do another one for 1968-ish.

Quote:
Outside the Makhnovists in the Ukraine, the anarchists were unable to exert much influence on the course of the revolution. Maximov was one of the most influential of anarchists in Russia, and Paul Avrich has conducted in-depth research.

Maybe we could make more of a thing about the articles we've got on anarchists in the russian revolution. I dunno, like direct links to Avrich's "anarchists in the russian revolution" and Maximov's "syndicalists..." instead of/as well the tag links.

Otherwise, looks pretty good. Fixed a couple of links (that panelling stuff is cool as fuck!) but all in all pretty sweet. Nice one mate! Reckon I'll try and find some stuff on Miasnikov and the Workers' Group now. Regarding the rest of the 'revolutionary wave' thing, what can I be doing to help out with that?

Mike Harman
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Sep 14 2007 09:59
Ed wrote:
yeah, looks good mate. Just a few bits
Quote:
it's context within the period 1905-1926 when revolution

Is this meant to be 1915-1926? Are you gonna add date qualifiers to the 'revolutionary wave' feature? Just reckon it might be interesting to do another one for 1968-ish.

Yes to both of those, and yes I reckon we should do features on all the major periods of class struggle (late '70s, '53-'56, '68+ etc.)

Quote:
Maybe we could make more of a thing about the articles we've got on anarchists in the russian revolution. I dunno, like direct links to Avrich's "anarchists in the russian revolution" and Maximov's "syndicalists..." instead of/as well the tag links.

Yeah taht's fine - we could maybe make Maximov/Avrich links to the tags, then mention specific articles as links after?

Quote:
Reckon I'll try and find some stuff on Miasnikov and the Workers' Group now.

Doesn't seem to be much, it's sometimes spelled Myasnikov if that helps.

Quote:
Regarding the rest of the 'revolutionary wave' thing, what can I be doing to help out with that?

I know we have Spain stuff c.1918 but it's not linked in the first post so would be good to have that referenced. Need to collate US/Canadian general strikes/IWW stuff like Wheatland hop riot. Major articles for each country need tagging with revolutionary wave (only one or two ideally). Maybe try to find any decent forum discussions which deal with the period. Any of that would be great!

David in Atlanta
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Sep 14 2007 11:10

I'll add a couple of other articles to the thing I posted about the Green Corn incident. I'd add it to history but I'm not sure of tags, etc. and I can't find a suitable graphic.

bastarx
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Sep 14 2007 11:43
Mike Harman wrote:

Was that you offering to write something up on the New South Wales general strike? Thanks Pete wink

This is all I can find on the 'net sad
http://www.takver.com/history/myunion/myunionapp07.htm
http://www.records.nsw.gov.au/archives/general_strike_of_1917_12707.asp

There's a slight chance, I've got a book, "Industrial Labour & Politics: The dynamics of the labour movement in eastern Australia 1900-1921" that has a chapter on it.

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Sep 14 2007 12:56

Hmm, I've done a bit of editing in the text (not much, just what you suggested above). Page looks a bit lopsided now though, do you reckon you could stick the Bolsheviks bit at the top of the right column, above the Kronstadt bit?

Yeah, done the variations of Myasnikov, still very little. Will keep plugging away though.

Also, I see you've changed the revolutionary wave title to include the date but left the url unchanged. Is that on purpose? Anyway, will start on the other stuff you suggested.

David in Atlanta
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Sep 15 2007 13:37

shaping up to be a really nifty feature. When its done to everyone's satisfaction, it should be linked on the front page. The history and articles sections are notoriously hard to navigate.

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Sep 15 2007 14:49

Just found this website with some interesting stuff on the German revolution, interviews with participants in mutinies etc. Not had a proper look at it yet but looks pretty interesting.

Also gonna stripmine the marxists site on the German Revolution too.

David in Atlanta
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Sep 15 2007 16:01
Ed wrote:
Just found this website with some interesting stuff on the German revolution, interviews with participants in mutinies etc. Not had a proper look at it yet but looks pretty interesting.

Also gonna stripmine the marxists site on the German Revolution too.

Far as I can tell, most of the interviews and documents are in German.
Great site though.

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Sep 15 2007 16:23

yeah, noticed that too embarrassed

Mike Harman
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Sep 16 2007 10:38

Ed, nice one mate, it's all coming together. I moved Bolsheviks to top of the right column, layout is pretty even now, maybe we could lose the featured article or make it full width down the bottom with a bigger pic? Looks out of place at the moment.

By the way, you could've done that yourself - just "show all" then drag and drop. Worth saving in between moves to make sure it remembers, still alpha code.

David in Atlanta - yeah we should do a front page link.

Also I'd like to make a decent looking block that shows on articles with certain tags since we get more people go to individual articles than via the index I think - code for doing that is here: http://drupal.org/node/69076

Mike Harman
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Sep 16 2007 10:39
David in Atlanta wrote:
Ed wrote:
Just found this website with some interesting stuff on the German revolution, interviews with participants in mutinies etc. Not had a proper look at it yet but looks pretty interesting.

Also gonna stripmine the marxists site on the German Revolution too.

Far as I can tell, most of the interviews and documents are in German.
Great site though.

anyone able to do translation from German wink

Mike Harman
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Sep 16 2007 10:44

OK so Russian Revolution is getting there, still needs decent banner and probably some rephrasing etc.

Will try to get a very quick one for the revolutionary wave set up later so we've got something to work with.

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Sep 16 2007 14:20

Reckon we should keep the featured article at the bottom but make it a full length thing. From an aesthetic point of view, I reckon the featured articles brighten up pages i.e. adds a picture and changes the tone of the writing. Also quite often come across something good by accident too!

As for the banner, not really my strongpoint. Maybe we could do some sort of collage of images? Or is that a really terrible idea?

Last thing, I tagged a bunch of stuff for the revolutionary wave thing but wasn't sure if the articles we had for Germany and Mexico were particularly apt. Also looked at the IWW stuff we've got for that period, its all pretty much about people getting killed (Ludlow Massacre, Joe Hill, Chilean White Terror etc). What should we do with those? And what are we doing with group histories (like the Industrial Workers of Africa)? Sticking them in or not?

David in Atlanta
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Sep 16 2007 14:58
Mike Harman wrote:
David in Atlanta wrote:
Ed wrote:
Just found this website with some interesting stuff on the German revolution, interviews with participants in mutinies etc. Not had a proper look at it yet but looks pretty interesting.

Also gonna stripmine the marxists site on the German Revolution too.

Far as I can tell, most of the interviews and documents are in German.
Great site though.

anyone able to do translation from German wink

he's got enough stuff in english to make it worth raiding (and amaziing photos), although if we want to republish the material rather than just link, i'd be in favor of asking. screw copyrights, but that seems to be a personal project and should be respected.

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Sep 16 2007 23:08

Here's two on the Oz Wobs;
http://libcom.org/library/memoirs-i-w-w-australia-bill-beattie
http://libcom.org/library/industrial-workers-world-australia-ian-bedford

Mike Harman
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Sep 17 2007 15:29

only idea for a graphic so far is a b/w world map with the flashpoints highlighted - vector world maps here: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:SVG_maps_of_the_world

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Sep 17 2007 17:01

Catch, stop ignoring me wink

Ed wrote:
Last thing, I tagged a bunch of stuff for the revolutionary wave thing but wasn't sure if the articles we had for Germany and Mexico were particularly apt. Also looked at the IWW stuff we've got for that period, its all pretty much about people getting killed (Ludlow Massacre, Joe Hill, Chilean White Terror etc). What should we do with those? And what are we doing with group histories (like the Industrial Workers of Africa)? Sticking them in or not?
Mike Harman
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Sep 17 2007 19:31

Sorry, thought I replied sad

Ed wrote:
Reckon we should keep the featured article at the bottom but make it a full length thing. From an aesthetic point of view, I reckon the featured articles brighten up pages i.e. adds a picture and changes the tone of the writing. Also quite often come across something good by accident too!

Cool I'll do that.

Quote:
As for the banner, not really my strongpoint. Maybe we could do some sort of collage of images? Or is that a really terrible idea?

Lefty collages often look shite, but if we could make a good one then why not! You mean for Russian Revolution? I reckon world map with either countries filled in or different size circles would be good for revolutionary wave and easy to do.

Quote:
Last thing, I tagged a bunch of stuff for the revolutionary wave thing but wasn't sure if the articles we had for Germany and Mexico were particularly apt.

Image gallery is good for Germany. Mexico we have the syndicalism thing Ret posted a while back - that's decently in depth so maybe that?

Quote:
Also looked at the IWW stuff we've got for that period, its all pretty much about people getting killed (Ludlow Massacre, Joe Hill, Chilean White Terror etc). What should we do with those?

Well that's what happened to the IWW - the failures and repression are as important as the successes imo - there's Wheatland Hop Riot and the general strikes a bit later as welll, so US might as well include all of that.

If you could edit links to those into the first post on this thread that'd be handy as well.

Quote:
And what are we doing with group histories (like the Industrial Workers of Africa)? Sticking them in or not?

There's very, very little on Africa, that I know about anyway - although I have some information on a rail strike and food riot in Sierra Leone I want to write up into something shortish. So definitely in the feature, not sure about the tag. I think the best bet for the feature is to do it loosely by our history regions (although merge UK into Western Europe which long-term I want to do anyway). We can always add them into a reading list, or regional overview within the (as yet unwritten) intro article.

So Western Europe, Eastern Europe, North America, South America, Africa, Asia, Oceania. We're only going to have 3-5 articles each for Africa and Oceania so make the best of it I guess.

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Sep 18 2007 03:03

Right, I've added the US wobbly repression stuff and the Chilean White Terror article to the original post. We've also got a few articles about US struggles which are just outside of the period, namely the Wheatland Hop Riot (1913), the Ludlow Massacre (1914) and the Colorado miners strike (1927). What do we want to do with these? Personally I'd be against extending the period coz then it'll start to lose meaning but maybe mention them in the feature as they were quite important events.

As for Germany and Mexico, yeah, okay I'll tag the syndicalism in Mexico thing but I think we should have some text on the German revolution. I'll hunt around for something else on the web but otherwise maybe we could use Paul Mattick's Anti-Bolshevist Communism in Germany? What do you reckon?

Agree with doing the feature by region (though I think UK should be separate from W. Europe in the site generally), looks good mate.

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Sep 18 2007 14:40
Ed wrote:
We've also got a few articles about US struggles which are just outside of the period, namely the Wheatland Hop Riot (1913), the Ludlow Massacre (1914) and the Colorado miners strike (1927). What do we want to do with these? Personally I'd be against extending the period coz then it'll start to lose meaning but maybe mention them in the feature as they were quite important events. [...]

okay I'll tag the syndicalism in Mexico

J. Hart wrote:
Industrial and urban working-class militancy, rooted in the labour struggles of colonial and post-independence Mexican society, grew rapidly during the political-economic crisis of pre-revolutionary Mexico between 1899 and 1910. During the revolution of 1910 militant workers created the anarchosyndicalist Casa del Obrero Mundial (Casa) (House of the Workers of the World), which grew rapidly until 1916 when an alliance of the state and capital successfully crushed it.

As the Mexican Revolution began in 1910 and the radical forces were all crushed by 1916 I think the period should be extended; to include the 1905 Revolution, which in many ways opened the period - and also the emergence of the IWW, founded 1905 and having its heyday from then until the repression of 1917?

Mike Harman
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Sep 18 2007 15:58

1905 was also the start of the Hibiya riot (nationalist riot against the terms of the Japan - Russia treaty but led to a whole series of protests later on which had more class content up to the rice riots- Era of Popular Violence).

I think we could extend back to 1905, and forward to 1927. There's an argument for starting during WWI, but some events clearly fall outside that scope so I don't see that as too much of an issue.

Mike Harman
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Sep 18 2007 18:02

OK very rough version of the map here: http://libcom.org/files/revmap.png

Not accurate with countries, just trying to get an idea whether blacking out the countries or big round splodges is best.

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Steven.
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Sep 19 2007 10:42

splodges!

Quote:
I think we could extend back to 1905, and forward to 1927

isn't that getting ridiculous?

Mike Harman
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Sep 19 2007 10:49
John. wrote:
splodges!
Quote:
I think we could extend back to 1905, and forward to 1927

isn't that getting ridiculous?

Not really, there's continuity between 1905 (end of the Russo-Japanese war + start of the IWW) and 1926/1927 (first five year plan, Shanghai + Canton communes, British general strike). Having said that, I think we can call it 1915-1926 (or a shorter period), but mention those other events in the feature and intro as background.

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Sep 19 2007 11:03
John. wrote:
splodges!
Quote:
I think we could extend back to 1905, and forward to 1927

isn't that getting ridiculous?

My feelings exactly. If we do that we could also extend it ten years to include the Spanish Civil War! Revolutionary Wave c. 1905-1936!

Even though there were important events which occured outside outside the period 1915-1926 I feel that these form more of an important backdrop to the wave rather than being part of it themselves. I mean, the 1905 Russian Revolution was a very important precursor in that it laid a lot of the foundations of soviets, use of general strikes etc but then the same could be said about the Paris Commune (as in it is also an important part of the revolutionary tradition). I'd be all for it being mentioned as an important event which had a big effect on the revolutionary period, but to include it in the revolutionary period would be a bit much imo.

Thinking about it, I would be in favour of starting the period at 1914. Even though I don't think we should focus too much on WW1 I do still think it'd have to be mentioned (war is the locomotive of history, innit wink ). Seriously though, I think the onset of WW1 had a lot do with the escalation of the threat of revolution so can see the feature being extended to include that. I'd be against extending it any further though.

Mike Harman
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Sep 19 2007 11:13

Alright then - let's stick to a short date range for the name (if it's short, I'd say 1917-1921 which includes Russia, Germany, Japan, Hungary, Brazil etc.), but then I still think we should be flexible with the content forwards and backwards.

PS. would be a good thread this, will start one later on.