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Multiculturalism, Equal Opportunities, and all that Bollocks

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daniel
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May 25 2007 18:05
Multiculturalism, Equal Opportunities, and all that Bollocks

Though I've never really bothered to read anything on race or any of that before, because i got firm enough views of my own, I recently read these two articles on Red Action's website and thought they were absolutely fucking dead on.

Time 'To Dump' Multiculturalism -
Race Attack -

in the "Race Attack" article G. O'Halloran wrote:
Consider then that in the sixties and seventies the struggle for equal rights offered a clear cut crusade without caveat. This meant campaigns against segregation, immigration controls, or any forms of institutional control in which different races were treated differently. Today, without noticeable pause for breath, it means campaigns for segregation; separate schools, youth clubs, demands to use different languages, and an insistence on the maintenance and celebration of particular cultural practices. This 'celebration of diversity' [race, gender and sexuality] has become for many former radicals the principle dynamic in society today. " The emergence of new subjects, new genders, new ethnicities, new regions, new communities," claims Marxism Today's Stuart Hall, who exemplifies the renegade trend " has given hitherto invisible groups the means to speak for themselves for the first time." Translated, this hogwash means that 'we have tried and failed to change society so we must accommodate ourselves to it as it is.'

Third Positionist fascists are also dedicated to multiculturalism, of course - diversity thru purity, purity thru division. I believe the BNP has a section just for Indians wanting to segregate from whites.

These articles reinforced my belief that equal opportunities, affirmative action and all that racially-slanted stuff divide and weaken the working class. As Jim Joad argues in Red Neck Manifesto (a book I'd love to get my hands on), the white working class is used as a scapegoat for all problems.

in the "Race Attack" article G. O'Halloran wrote:
That it is from these same intellectual circles, that racism today is regarded, as essentially the preserve of the 'lower orders' is apt. Subsequently if police are racist it is because of the 'brutish class' from which they are recruited and so on. It is no secret that for many of the media covering the Lawrence inquiry, the term 'white working class' and racist thug are synonymous. Reflecting the climate, an anarchist magazine (once associated with AFA) felt the need in a recent editorial to rationalise 'inherent working class racism.' Not only an English disease either, this is a concept with international dimensions.

The media blames white working class racism for a host of social problems. It is totally acceptable to talk about "white trash", wealthy black comedians can poke fun at "inbred, dirty, redneck crackers", but the reaction against the slightest percieved anti-blac racism is treated hysterically!

More thoughts to come...

David in Atlanta
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May 25 2007 20:36

Speaking as a redneck (i qualify, my family roots in the deep south go back to pre-revolutionary times, my grandaddy worked in a cotton mill, etc) and having read it, Goad's book is utter crap.

He makes a valid point about the origins of the white working class in North America, that many of the early Anglo-Scots-Irish settlers were bond servants who did not want to come here, but manages to conflate that with plantation system lifetime chattel slavery.Different system of exploitation completely.

He downplays the reality of street level working class racism and seems to think the subculture of crank and violence is all good fun after a days work.
In his uberworking class way, he's as bad as Hakim Bay.

If you're going to read that, read Bastard Out of Carolina by Dorothy Allison or
Red Dirt: Growing up Okie by Roxanne Dunbar Ortiz or one of my favorites,
The Year the Lights Came by Terry Kay

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daniel
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May 26 2007 02:41

Cheers mate. What's your thoughts on all this? I mean obviously racism is a major problem but the idea of white privilege and the ideology of white guilt in totally counterproductive. It'll always stay with me the time this black guy came to a give a talk about white privilege and all that, and a mate of mine spoke up and told how this one black senator had hit some security guy in an airport cos she didn't want to go thru the scan-thing. Guess what he says --- she must have snapped under all the racism. Not she a privileged slag who thinks she can get away with anything cos she's rich and powerful - no its cos she's black and it was understandable. And then he's off about 400 years of slavery and bla bla bla...

Meanwhile my old mate's brother (white) is getting jailed cos of a late fucking library fine! That's for real. wall

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welshboy
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May 26 2007 09:49

Jailed for a library fine!?!

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Joseph Kay
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May 26 2007 12:21

i'm all for multiculturalist bollocks, if it means Watford get sponsored by Arcelik and Koc Holding grin

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daniel
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May 26 2007 23:17
welshboy wrote:
Jailed for a library fine!?!

Yup. He got a book out of the library, his mate nicked the book, he thought his mate would return it for him, he left town for a while, came back and there was a huge fine which he couldn't afford, and so...

fuck I hate capitalism...

dowcet
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May 27 2007 04:38

I totally disagree with this idea that ethnic communities (or any other specific groups, such as subcultures of choice, or people with disabilities) who demand power in an autonomous sense are undermining more universal revolutionary changes. Do people not deserve the the right to say, speak the language they want to speak? Almost by definition, to be anti-authoritarian means supporting people's right to articulate autonomous collectivities, however they might see fit. Only when one of these collectivities ("the white race" for example) holds property or power over another is there a problem.

There is such a thing as liberal multiculturalism, which says "capitalism and bourgeois democracy are fine, look at all these fun colorful people who can be a part of it!" and I'm against that... but then there is the genuine pluralism of non-power embodied in the Zapatista slogan, "The world we want is a world in which many worlds fit."

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EdmontonWobbly
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May 27 2007 18:06

Goad is also an ideologically committed misogynist, has been convicted of beating his girlfriend, and in Redneck Manifesto argues that all women harbour rape fantasies. I would say that his history of the early stages of Irish slavery is pretty good and he is a very talented writer, however I don't think thats enought validate line after line of completely backwards reactionary crap he writes in that book. I totally agree that he's dangerous in the same way Hakim Bey is. I've got redneck credentials of my own and I find this sort of stuff pretty reprehensible. Really all he is doing is taking bad stereotypes of rural working class whites and instead of shooting them down for what they are, myths, he runs with it and writes apologia. I would be extremely sceptical of any group that uses his writings as a basis for their stance on race (or gender for that matter).

tastypudding
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May 27 2007 22:52
Quote:
These articles reinforced my belief that equal opportunities, affirmative action and all that racially-slanted stuff divide and weaken the working class.

i don´t agree with that. if something divides the working class it´s the existing racism and the construction of identities iwith race as their most important element. i think affirmative action rather tends to weaken the idea that division in society mainly happens along race lines.

tastypudding
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May 27 2007 23:09
dowcet wrote:
I totally disagree with this idea that ethnic communities (or any other specific groups, such as subcultures of choice, or people with disabilities) who demand power in an autonomous sense are undermining more universal revolutionary changes.

it depends on what grounds they demand autonomy. the zapatistas are a positive example because their project is not so much based on ethnicity, but on the social posiion of indigenous people in mexican society. while of course most zapatistas have an identy that can be described as etnic/indigenous, they also create more possibilities for self-determination via the betterment of education, the revolutionary women´s laws etc. for example, a lot of women joined the ezln to escape the social roles they were expected to fufill in their communities.
movements, on the other hand, that place the most emphasis on ethnicity, are highly repressive towards the inside, because they don´t accept deviations from the "natural identity" that they ascribe to themselves. for example, felipe quispe´s aymara-movement in bolivia that calls for autonomy with the goal to rebuild the inca state.

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JoeMaguire
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May 28 2007 11:10
tastypudding wrote:
Quote:
These articles reinforced my belief that equal opportunities, affirmative action and all that racially-slanted stuff divide and weaken the working class.

i don´t agree with that. if something divides the working class it´s the existing racism and the construction of identities iwith race as their most important element. i think affirmative action rather tends to weaken the idea that division in society mainly happens along race lines.

The problem that some on the left have is distinguishing liberal anti racism with w/c anti-racism. Issues which rotate entirely around race, are a huge no, no for us as they reinforce the hold of liberals and racial segregationists of all type. We should pose working class solutions as a class.

For example in Burnley we had council after council awarding privileges/grants to an asian community (one of the poorest areas in the country) knowing full well they would be rewarded by a large bloc vote (unlike in less socially cohesive white areas). It would have been fair to say that some lefts would have welcomed even campaigned on the improvements, but they proved to be one of several points which sparked the rise of the BNP. To campaign around an area because it was poor is acceptable, but to make it a race issue is utterly disingenious.

Having also studdied things like affirmative action I have to say it doesnt aid poor blacks as its often claimed but its a front for middle class blacks to utilise the system in their favour. Because they are in a position to jump the hoops and organise themselves better than theyre working class counterparts.

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May 28 2007 14:41
Quote:
A gay pub in the city of Melbourne has won the right to ban heterosexuals

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/6697469.stm

apparently too many hen parties coming to point and stare ...

Flint
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May 28 2007 16:08

revolutionrugger suggested to me this weekend that European anarchist expats in the U.S. should have a ten year moratorium before they are allowed to publicly discuss race. I suspect that he might be wise and that we should consider such a policy.

Deezer
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May 28 2007 16:20

I think there are extremely different experiences and historys of racism at work in the USA when compared to, ugh, for want of a better term, Europe. I reckon that a lot of folk from over here don't necessarily consider that when discussing race issues in relation to the USA but at least as annoyingly yankee (and possibly Canadian?) anarcho's seem insistent on trying to an analysis of racism that (even if it is applicable to the USA) really makes absofuckinglutely no sense over here.

So both flint and Jacks suggestions are both valid as far as I can make out grin

I am being sorta serious here though.

Deezer
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May 28 2007 16:26

That and a big dollop of privileged middle-class American white guilt that they want everyone in Europe to feel just as bad as they do...

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May 28 2007 22:49
dowcet wrote:
Do people not deserve the the right to say, speak the language they want to speak? Almost by definition, to be anti-authoritarian means supporting people's right to articulate autonomous collectivities, however they might see fit.

thats different than campaigning for segregated housing or segregated schools.

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May 28 2007 22:53
Flint wrote:
revolutionrugger suggested to me this weekend that European anarchist expats in the U.S. should have a ten year moratorium before they are allowed to publicly discuss race. I suspect that he might be wise and that we should consider such a policy.

roll eyes well actually i'm half Yank - racially suppressed and all. half New Yoik Jew. smile

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May 28 2007 23:01
EdmontonWobbly wrote:
Goad is also an ideologically committed misogynist, has been convicted of beating his girlfriend, and in Redneck Manifesto argues that all women harbour rape fantasies. I would say that his history of the early stages of Irish slavery is pretty good and he is a very talented writer, however I don't think thats enought validate line after line of completely backwards reactionary crap he writes in that book. I totally agree that he's dangerous in the same way Hakim Bey is. I've got redneck credentials of my own and I find this sort of stuff pretty reprehensible. Really all he is doing is taking bad stereotypes of rural working class whites and instead of shooting them down for what they are, myths, he runs with it and writes apologia. I would be extremely sceptical of any group that uses his writings as a basis for their stance on race (or gender for that matter).

ah, well, too bad. As I said, i never read his book, just a review. Still, i figured it might be an interestingly fresh perspective. I've never read a book on race before, couldn't be bothered. So much of it looks like a load of whingy guilt-ridden bollocks. course, seeing as i never read any of it that's a little narrow minded but hey.

october_lost wrote:
Having also studdied things like affirmative action I have to say it doesnt aid poor blacks as its often claimed but its a front for middle class blacks to utilise the system in their favour. Because they are in a position to jump the hoops and organise themselves better than theyre working class counterparts.

Hmm, interesting. Could you expand?

I'd been more looking for a discussion of the two Red Action pieces. I thought they was ace. a bit crude, some of you might say, but I'd say hard hitting. I'll add them to libcom...

Flint
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May 29 2007 01:03
daniel wrote:
I've never read a book on race before, couldn't be bothered. So much of it looks like a load of whingy guilt-ridden bollocks. course, seeing as i never read any of it that's a little narrow minded but hey.

End thread.

tastypudding
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May 29 2007 01:37
october_lost wrote:
tastypudding wrote:
Quote:
These articles reinforced my belief that equal opportunities, affirmative action and all that racially-slanted stuff divide and weaken the working class.

i don´t agree with that. if something divides the working class it´s the existing racism and the construction of identities iwith race as their most important element. i think affirmative action rather tends to weaken the idea that division in society mainly happens along race lines.

The problem that some on the left have is distinguishing liberal anti racism with w/c anti-racism. Issues which rotate entirely around race, are a huge no, no for us as they reinforce the hold of liberals and racial segregationists of all type. We should pose working class solutions as a class.

you somewhat misunderstood my post. i didn´t mean that affirmative action is all that great, but ask yourself this: is it more likely that w/c black people will see racism as the main element of oppresion if without affirmative action 5% of people with access to hogher eduation are black, or if with aa its 10% (don´t know the actual numbers), but their lives are still shit? th issue is a lot more complex than this of course, but logically, it should have a small effect.

Quote:
It would have been fair to say that some lefts would have welcomed even campaigned on the improvements, but they proved to be one of several points which sparked the rise of the BNP.

i don´t like this logic one bit. if you see the bnp gaining support as a valid reason to dislike these measures, then you´re already giving in to the demands of the bnp. i guess you wouldn´t say that immigration should be regulated more strongly because if not the bnp will get stronger?

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May 29 2007 04:20
daniel wrote:
the idea of white privilege and the ideology of white guilt in totally counterproductive.
revol68 wrote:
how about we trade in ten years learning and experiance for a big bucket of guilt
Boulcolonialboy wrote:
That and a big dollop of privileged middle-class American white guilt
daniel wrote:
So much of it looks like a load of whingy guilt-ridden bollocks

I don't know if you keep repeating this because you think it's some kind of amazing outsider insight but the whole "all white anti-racists are just acting out middle class guilt" thing is a really worn out path of a conversation here, and is definitely a page out of the same book as "how ironic, anarchists forming an organization?" and "she says she's against capitalism, but she works at one of the most unethical factories there is!".

If you're interested in Jim Goad why not go all the way on this and really worry about "white guilt".

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May 29 2007 07:38
tastypudding wrote:
i don´t like this logic one bit. if you see the bnp gaining support as a valid reason to dislike these measures, then you´re already giving in to the demands of the bnp. i guess you wouldn´t say that immigration should be regulated more strongly because if not the bnp will get stronger?

the point is that in racialising issues that have nothing to do with race, we've already surrendered the terms of debate to the liberal-fascist spectrum by abandoning class analysis. areas should not get money because they're inhabited by brown people, white people, blue people - we should fight for resources on the basis of need. now if there is systematic racism then the people most in need will happen to be working class people of a minority ethnicity, but so what? the colour of someones skin is of absolutely no importance.

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May 29 2007 09:08
Jack wrote:
MJ wrote:
I don't know if you keep repeating this because you think it's some kind of amazing outsider insight but the whole "all white anti-racists are just acting out middle class guilt" thing is a really worn out path of a conversation here, and is definitely a page out of the same book as "how ironic, anarchists forming an organization?" and "she says she's against capitalism, but she works at one of the most unethical factories there is!".

If you're interested in Jim Goad why not go all the way on this and really worry about "white guilt".

On a scale of 1 to 10, how sorry are you for slavery?

I sent an apology letter.

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May 29 2007 09:15
Jack wrote:
Apparently all blacks thank you for it.

Oh good. I was worried when I didn't hear back.

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May 29 2007 09:43
october_lost wrote:
Having also studdied things like affirmative action I have to say it doesnt aid poor blacks as its often claimed but its a front for middle class blacks to utilise the system in their favour. Because they are in a position to jump the hoops and organise themselves better than theyre working class counterparts.

Although you are right that there has been problems with affirmative action benefitting the middle class more than intended. But from studying affirmative action in a labour economics course I took I was surprised to learn that this was not as big a problem as I would have expected. Maybe we've been reading different things. I remember reading bits of Barbara R Bergman's book and that being interesting and I read a few other articles which I could probably dig up if you wanted.

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May 29 2007 09:52

Eeek that last post sounds really condescending. I didn't mean it too.

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May 29 2007 09:54
georgestapleton wrote:
Eeek that last post sounds really condescending. I didn't mean it too.

Could you be more riddled with guilt?

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May 29 2007 10:00

No I'm irish and from dublin and from according to Ross O Carroll Kelly, the northside on the southisde so accroding to roddy doyle.

Roddy Doyle wrote:
Do you not get it, lads? The Irish are the blacks of Europe. And Dubliners are the blacks of Ireland. And the Northside Dubliners are the blacks of Dublin. So say it once, say it loud: I'm black and I'm proud.

An american told me I was black once. (And for those of you who don't know me I'm a ginger with freckles and skin so white i make wacko jacko jealous).

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May 29 2007 10:04

Also before GDID comes on I know I'm not from the northside. But fuck off the quote wouldn't have worked otherwise. Anyway an american did tell me I was black once.

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May 29 2007 10:13

Actually she was a polish jew who grew up in brooklyn. Here da was involved in solaridnosc and the had to flee poland in the 80s. So she wasn't black. But apparently I am. Or maybe she was despite being white, christ I don't know. The point is I'm black.

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May 29 2007 10:15

She definately said whack.