Zezta International - Is anyone going

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Dundee_United
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Nov 21 2006 16:08
Zezta International - Is anyone going

Hi folks,
I dind't realise the EZLN's attempts to launch a new democratic socialist/libertarian international were this far advanced. I anyone going. Nice date tho.

Invitación a Encuentros entre los pueblos Zapatistas y los pueblos del mundo

COMUNICADO DEL COMITÉ CLANDESTINO REVOLUCIONARIO INDÍGENA-COMANDANCIA GENERAL DEL EJÉRCITO ZAPATISTA DE LIBERACIÓN NACIONAL.

MÉXICO.

COMISIÓN INTERGALÁCTICA - COMISIÓN SEXTA.

2 DE OCTUBRE DEL 2006.

A LOS PUEBLOS DEL MUNDO.
A LOS Y LAS ADHERENTES A LA ZEZTA INTERNACIONAL DE LOS CINCO CONTINENTES

COMPAÑEROS Y COMPAÑERAS:

EL EZLN, A TRAVÉS DE SU COMISIÓN INTERGALÁCTICA Y SU COMISIÓN SEXTA, CONVOCA A: ENCUENTROS DE LOS PUEBLOS ZAPATISTAS CON LOS PUEBLOS DEL MUNDO.

EL PRIMERO SERÁ PARA EL 30, 31 DE DICIEMBRE DEL 2006 Y 1 Y 2 DE ENERO DEL 2007. CELEBRARLO EN EL CARACOL DE OVENTIK. CON LOS SIGUIENTES OBJETIVOS:

UNO- CON EL FIN DE QUE LAS DIFERENTES ORGANIZACIONES, GRUPOS, COLECTIVOS E INDIVIDUAS, INDIVIDUOS DE OTROS PAÍSES, QUE LUCHAN, RESISTEN EN LOS CINCO CONTINENTES QUE LUCHAN POR LA HUMANIDAD Y CONTRA EL NEOLIBERALISMO, QUE CONOZCAN LAS EXPERIENCIAS DE LUCHA Y COMO SE ORGANIZAN CON SU GOBIERNO DE LAS COMUNIDADES INDÍGENAS ZAPATISTAS, QUE ELLAS Y ELLOS PLATIQUEN DIRECTAMENTE LOS CINCO JUNTAS DE BUEN GOBIERNO, CON LOS Y LAS PRESENTES A ESE ENCUENTRO.

DOS- QUE LOS PUEBLOS ZAPATISTAS Y SUS AUTORIDADES CONOZCAN CON SU PROPIA VOZ DE LAS EXPERIENCIAS E HISTORIAS DE LUCHA DE OTROS PAÍSES DE LOS CINCO CONTINENTES QUE LUCHAN Y RESISTEN POR LA HUMANIDAD Y CONTRA EL NEOLIBERALISMO.

TRES- QUE LOS PUEBLOS ZAPATISTAS Y LAS ORGANIZACIONES, GRUPOS, COLECTIVOS E INDIVIDUAS, INDIVIDUOS, DE OTROS PAÍSES, QUE LUCHAN Y RESISTEN EN TODO EL MUNDO CONTRA EL NEOLIBERALISMO Y POR LA HUMANIDAD SE PUEDAN RELACIONAR DIRECTAMENTE SIN INTERMEDIARIO PARA BRINDARSE APOYO Y SOLIDARIDAD MUTUAMENTE.

CUATRO- PROPONER Y ACORDAR MEDIOS, MODOS Y FORMAS DE COMUNICACIÓN ENTRE LAS ORGANIZACIONES, GRUPOS, COLECTIVOS E INDIVIDUAS, INDIVIDUOS QUE LUCHAN Y RESISTEN EN LOS CINCO CONTINENTES.

QUINTO- DAR UN MENSAJE DE ALIENTO A LAS LUCHAS QUE, CONTRA EL PODER DEL DINERO, ACTUALMENTE SOSTIENEN PUEBLOS EN DIVERSOS PUNTOS DEL PLANETA.

SEXTO- HACER Y DISCUTIR PROPUESTAS PARA EL PRÓXIMO ENCUENTRO INTERGALÁCTICO, INCLUYENDO FECHAS Y LUGARES.

EL SEGUNDO ENCUENTRO SERÁ PARA EL 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29,30 Y 31 DE JULIO DEL 2007.
CELEBRARLO EN LOS CINCO CARACOLES. CON LOS MISMOS OBJETIVOS.

21 DE JULIO EN CARACOL OVENTIK. INAGURACIÓN.
22 DE JULIO TRABAJO.
23 DE JULIO TRASLADARSE AL CARACOL DE MORELIA.
24 DE JULIO TRABAJO.
25 TRASLADARSE AL CARACOL DE ROBERTO BARRIOS.
26 TRABAJO.
27 TRASLADARSE AL CARACOL DE LA GARRUCHA.
28 TRABAJO.
29 TRASLADARSE AL CARACOL DE LA REALIDAD.
30 TRABAJO Y CLAUSURA.
31 REGRESO A SAN CRISTÓBAL

EN CADA CARACOL PARTICIPARAN, AUTORIDADES DE LOS MAREZ Y LA JUNTA DE BUEN GOBIERNO, COMPAÑERAS COMANDANTAS, COMPAÑEROS COMANDANTES. DONDE CONTARAN EXPERIENCIAS DE LUCHA CON SUS GOBIERNOS AUTÓNOMOS, PERO SOBRE TODO PARA QUE VAYAMOS DISCUTIENDO PROPUESTAS PARA EL MERO PRÓXIMO ENCUENTRO INTERGALÁCTICO, INCLUYENDO FECHAS Y LUGARES.

Desde las montañas del Sureste Mexicano.
Por el Comité Clandestino Revolucionario Indígena - Comandancia General del Ejército Zapatista de Liberación Nacional.

Teniente Coronel Insurgente Moisés.
Comisión Intergaláctica
del EZLN.

Subcomandante Insurgente Marcos.
Comisión Sexta
del EZLN.

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Steven.
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Nov 21 2006 16:22

Instead of a big c&p in spanish could you not just provide a link to a description in english?

Dundee_United
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Nov 21 2006 16:49

Thought somebody might say something crap like that. No coz there isn't one, and my Spanish isn't good enough to do a proper translation. That's also not a big cut and paste. ;-p

The website is http://www.zeztainternazional.org/

It's all in Spanish.

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ginger
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Nov 21 2006 20:52

From the google-is-your-friend dept :

Invitation to Encounter between the Zapatistas towns and the towns of the world

Official notice of general clandestine committee revolutionary indígena-comandancia of army zapatista of national liberation. Mexico. Intergalactic commission - commission sixth. 2 of october of the 2006.

To the towns of the world. To and the adherents to the zezta the international of the five continents companions and companions: the ezln, through their intergalactic commission and its commission sixth, summons an encounter of towns zapatistas with the towns of the world.

First it will be for the 30, 31 of December of 2006 and 1st and 2nd of January of the 2007. To celebrate it in the oventik snail with the following objectives:

One in order that different organizations, groups, groups and individual, individual of other countries, that fights, resist in five continents which they fight by the humanity and against the neoliberalism, that know the experiences fight and as they are organized with his government of the indigenous communities zapatistas, that they and they platiquen directly the five meetings of good government, with and the presents to that encounter.

Two which towns zapatistas and their authorities know with their own voice of the experiences and histories of fight of other countries of the five continents that fight and resist by the humanity and against the neoliberalism.

Three that the towns zapatistas and the organizations, groups, individual groups and, individual, of other countries, that fight and resist anywhere in the world against the neoliberalism and by the humanity they are possible to be related directly without intermediary to offer to support and solidarity mutually.

Four to propose and to decide average, ways and forms of communication between the organizations, groups, individual groups and, individual that fight and resist in the five continents.

Fifth to give a message of breath to the fights that, against the power of the money, at the moment maintain towns in diverse points of the planet.

Sixth to make and to discuss proposals for the next intergalactic encounter, including dates and places. The second encounter will be for the 21st - 31st July 2007. To celebrate it in the five snails.

With such objective. 21 of July in snail oventik. Inauguration. 22 of July work. 23 of July to be transferred to the morelia snail. 24 of July work. 25 to be transferred to the snail de roberto districts. 26 work. 27 to be transferred to the snail of the pulley. 28 work. 29 to be transferred to the snail of the reality. 30 work and closing. 31 return to san cristóbal in each snail they participated, authorities of the marez and the meeting of good government, companions comandantas, companions commanders. Where they counted experiences of fight with its independent governments, but mainly so that we are discussing propose for the mere next intergalactic encounter, including dates and places.

From mountains of the Mexican Southeastern.
By the Clandestine Committee Revolutionary Native - Separate military command of the Army Zapatista de Liberación Nacional.
Lieutenant Colonel Insurgente Moisés.
Intergalactic commission of the EZLN.
Insurgent Subcommander Marcos.
Commission Sixth of the EZLN.

Dundee_United
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Nov 24 2006 23:39

So?

Dundee_United
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Nov 26 2006 20:25

Look I would have thought this discussion would be quite an important one at the moment, especially given what's going on in Oaxaca - why has nobody responded (positively or negatively) to the EZLN/Zapatista's attempt now to form an international. I mean more people have commented on the HIV thread!

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Felix Frost
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Nov 26 2006 21:41

I don't think they are proposing to form a new international, just a series of international gatherings.

I'd like to go, but Chiapas is a bit too far away, and I don't speak Spanish.

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Serge Forward
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Nov 26 2006 22:40

Is this the same as the Sixth Declaration of the Lacondon Jungle thingy?

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AndrewF
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Nov 27 2006 11:56

Nope, its rather hard to be sure from the translation but it appears to be a call to two organisation meetings to organise for another intergalatic encounter like that held in Chiapas in 1996 - http://flag.blackened.net/revolt/andrew/encounter1_report.html - and the Spanish state in 1997 - http://flag.blackened.net/revolt/andrew/encounter2_report.html

I think that this idea is mentioned in the 6th but this is a new document (BTW the word 'snails' in the document is better translated as 'meeting place')

Dundee_United
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Nov 27 2006 18:13

No it says elsewhere basically that they're trying to form an international - hence the use of the word. They're couching it in the whole 'cosmic/intergalactic' type humour, hence the use of the (apparently) nonsense word Zezta. It does appear tho that they're deadly serious about it tho - the internationalisation of the other campaign. The idea makes sense given Mexico's political climate at the moment, but I think more than any other movement in the world this has a chance of providing an opportunity to unite the world's socialist movement.

As Joe says tho the translation is pretty punk. Hence the Mayan imagery of the conch-shell and the Zap's literal meaning of the word as district/commune being translated as
snail shell.

I think it would be wrong to write this off as just another Zapatista Encuentro. That doesn't seem what is being proposed at all. I think it merits very serious discussion. What is being proposed is the first couple of meetings of a new international based on those willing to work along the lines of the Sixth declaration, and in solidarity with the other campaign.

Emilia85
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Dec 7 2006 01:34

I agree, this is more than "just another encuentro." Through word of mouth by someone who is close to the planning, I heard that it is an "Intergalactic." I had plans to be in Oaxaca just after the encuentro, but was able to change my flight to arrive in time to take a bus to San Cristobal on Dec. 30. So, I will be there despite having no one to travel with and mediocre Spanish skills...

gerrardw
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Dec 7 2006 17:49

Hi all,

I agree with Nick etc, this is VERY important to me, it is an attempt to unite all those fighting capitalism below and to the left into a true organised international movement. Its really disapointing currently to see the only people taking it seriously are liberals, and to see many class-struggle types and libertarian communists etc, dismissing it as some 'activisty' zapatista thing. aarrgghhh... talk about anarchists missing the boat!

Oh well, anyway I know a couple of people who are going to this first preparatory meeting in Chiapas, and Im hoping to be going with some comrades to the next preparatory meeting in July/August (though have total current funds of 42p so...... anyone wanna sponsor me? no? oh...)

Dundee_United
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Dec 8 2006 02:13

The IWW ballot international ballot to affiliate to the Sixth Declaration lost much more narrowly than was to be expected. That actually bodes quite well - I thought it would be a complete wipeout.

gerrardw
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Dec 8 2006 16:24

Hi,

Really? When was that taken?

Yeah sounds promising in a way, I would have expected it to be a wipeout too, but on the other hand, its still frustrating that its even that contentious... Oh well, gotta look on the bright side and all that! smile

Do you have any info on what the main reasons for people not wanting to affiliate where? And how narrowly did it lose?

knightrose
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Dec 8 2006 17:20

The reasons for not affiliating had a lot to do with the call for unity across classes in the document, I think.

Dundee_United
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Dec 9 2006 22:38
Quote:
The reasons for not affiliating had a lot to do with the call for unity across classes in the document, I think.

The document refers in a huge list of oppressed and marginalised groups in an extremely rhetorical call to unity to 'microbusinesses, small shopkeepers...' It's just rhetoric.

Frankly anyone who seriously wants to discuss that in such pretentious high minded political ideals ought to take a look at themselves. The document plainly does not call for cross class alliances. That's just wankery that someone's come up with as an afterthought because they don't want to discuss their actual opinions.

pgh2a
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Dec 9 2006 23:07
knightrose wrote:
The reasons for not affiliating had a lot to do with the call for unity across classes in the document, I think.

That and the general touchy, feely, rather unclear nature of the translation itself. There was some confusion over whether there was, in fact, an invitation to non-Mexican groups to adhere, and of course, there was debate over what precisely the IWW would be committed to through "adhesion," and what others would take it as a mandate to do. And some members got frightened-off by the references to the Mexican Constitution, no doubt.

There was additional discussion over what material support this would actually lend to the struggle, and whether there were alternate ways of providing the support without getting entangled in a document which was not well understood by many of our members. There was also a desire not to set further precedent for passing resolutions for every political movement, and the time that comes along with debating these things, rather than doing solid organizing work on the ground to build-up the union as a force which can more actively contribute to these struggles in the future.

There was also some question as to what was meant by alliances with non-electoral leftist parties, as there are many *political* parties which declare themselves non-electoral, yet still have the goal of seizing state power.

Wobbly Preacher also made some good points re: the Sixth Declaration, and the relationship of other groups in Mexico who are not affiliated, so perhaps they will post more on this.

pgh2a
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Dec 9 2006 23:15
Dundee_United wrote:
The document refers in a huge list of oppressed and marginalised groups in an extremely rhetorical call to unity to 'microbusinesses, small shopkeepers...' It's just rhetoric.

It may be, but it wasn't clear from the document to which we were asked to *adhere* as an organization. Given the fact that some of this language could have included employers, it certainly raised the hackles on those of us who are committed to upholding the principles of the Preamble and the I.W.W. Constitution.

Skraeling
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Dec 10 2006 04:34

What is the relationship for this call for an new encuentro vs. neoliberalism and the People's Global Action network? I thought the PGA was (if drug hazed memory serves me right) the international network formed at one of the last encuentros, so why call for a new anti-neoliberal international when there is already one in PGA? (I don't think its a call to form a new international. I think the EZLN are part of the PGA. (Back in my anti-capitalist activistoid days, I used to be in PGA Aotearoa and helped organise some stuff here and there, its good side that it was one of the few anarchistic networks that loads of indigeneous people were in. I wont go into its bad side hint: i never bought into the romanticisation of the EZLN. The PGA also supported small businesses).

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Dec 10 2006 09:28

I voted against it because it had barely been discussed in the British Isles IWW and I personally knew very little about it. I was also suspicious of the cross-class stuff and unclear about what kind of grouping we would be affiliating to. If it comes up again, members should be fully informed and the issue will need to be to be properly discussed.

gerrardw
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Dec 10 2006 15:42

Hi all,

Yeh, understand any problem with being not well informed and confused about some of it...

In our group this has been a problem and so for the past two weeks people are supposed to have been reading the 6th and surrounding documents and aquainting themselves with this, and then this weeks meeting will be wholly dedicated to a discussion of whether to adhere or not - obviously I hope we do.

In terms of the 'cross-class unity' thing, yeh I agree with Dundee, it really shouldnt be such an issue, I mean the whole document is VERY clearly anti-capitalist and anti-authoritarian, so how could it be pro-boss?!

Groups outside Mexico are obviously invited to adhere, it contains specific parts refering to the international struggle, as well as the bits referring to just the national struggle and how can you have an 'international' gathering and process, without any groups from other countries....? And if you adhere you surely adhere to taking your part in the zesta intercontinental and this process and making it go where it can go.

As im not in IWW, Im not very clear about your process' etc. How did this vote come about in the first place? And is it likely to be brought up again? Is there any plans for people to aquint themselves with the subject so that when brought up again, people are properly informed?

Has it been raised/discussed much at all in Afed and Solfed or IWA etc etc?

Lastly, as we and others are planning to go to the second preparatory meeting in July (and some folks are allready on their way to the first preparatory meeting in December/Jan) maybe these queries and concerns could be taken by us to these meetings and raised in effort to get clarifications and, if necessary and possible, modifications to enable this global networking amongst the class-struggle anti-capitalist/anti-authoritarian left to continue?

gerrardw
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Dec 10 2006 15:44

By the way, I think this stuff goes way beyond PGA. In my opinion it is closer to what Dundee says about an international. PGA was madly loose 'networking tool' not a proper organisation, whereas I think with the Other and Zesta, whats being discussed is something much more organised and concrete than that

pgh2a
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Dec 10 2006 16:25
gerrardw wrote:
As im not in IWW, Im not very clear about your process' etc. How did this vote come about in the first place? And is it likely to be brought up again? Is there any plans for people to aquint themselves with the subject so that when brought up again, people are properly informed?

Well, in this case the matter was presented by a branch of the union to the General Assembly. It was referred to a committee, which then provided a recommendation to the Assembly that is should be passed. The Assembly then voted to send the item on adherence to referendum with recommendation, after some debate on the measure. The union's membership, voting in referendum, defeated the measure, but not overwhelmingly. It's certainly possible to bring a similar proposal to the next General Assembly. Technically, the GEB could send the item to referendum sooner, but I doubt this will happen.

As a labor union, I think some members were concerned that while there was an overall anti-capitalist tone to the Declaration, we should not be entering into alliances with employers under any circumstances. An argument was actually made that adherence to the policy would conflict with the Preamble of the Constitution about the working class and the employing class having nothing in common. I think this was a sound argument.

Dundee_United
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Dec 10 2006 16:42
Quote:
What is the relationship for this call for an new encuentro vs. neoliberalism and the People's Global Action network?

It isn't an encuentro against neoliberalism. I has nothing to do with the PGA. It's an attempt to form a socialist international. The Sixth declaration was a document aimed at the Mexican Left and a 'Sixth Commission' was formed to build up 'the other campaign' around those who agreed with this document. The Zezta International/Enlace grouping was tasked to work on drawing together the left from the rest of the world to discuss a basis for unity. In Europe basically only liberals have answered this call, so perhaps it will end up as shite as the PGA, but that certainly is not the intention. The intention is quite obviously to build a socialist international. The PGA is not involved with this.

Quote:
Given the fact that some of this language could have included employers,

Only if you're being pedantic, and only then if you're actually being pedantic to hide your real views.

Quote:
some members got frightened-off by the references to the Mexican Constitution

This is the real reason.

Quote:
I voted against it because it had barely been discussed in the British Isles IWW and I personally knew very little about it. I was also suspicious of the cross-class stuff and unclear about what kind of grouping we would be affiliating to. If it comes up again, members should be fully informed and the issue will need to be to be properly discussed.

Precisely. The IWW motion was pish. It was badly framed. It made no reference to the actual organisation (Zezta International) that we were being asked to join, and what the sixth declaration actually was and lots of IWW members clearly had lots of misapprehensions (e.g. all the cross class nonsense), which those who didn't like the motion chose to exploit. I mean that one is a classic - cross class... I mean what the fuck? That just seems pathetic to me. It's not like the document asks adherents to side with leading industrialists for fuck sake. It refers in a huge list of marginalised groups who 'should unite' to microbusinesses and small shopkeepers.

The motion should have read - 'that the IWW commit to sending delegates to the first and second conferences of the Zezta International to find out if and where we can collaborate with the new international.' Clearly some people were quite keen that this didn't happen.

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Dec 10 2006 17:37

Now if it had been phrased like that, I wouldn't have had a big problem with it. I'm all for factfinding. But asking people to vote to willy-nilly affiliate to some vague initiative we know bugger all about was bloody daft.

pgh2a
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Dec 10 2006 21:49
Dundee_United wrote:
The motion should have read - 'that the IWW commit to sending delegates to the first and second conferences of the Zezta International to find out if and where we can collaborate with the new international.' Clearly some people were quite keen that this didn't happen.

I actually chaired the Resolutions Committee at Assembly dealing with this. The members of the committee did not want to just send a delegate, they wanted the IWW to adhere to the Declaration -- their language. We tried to phrase the committee's desire as clearly as possible. Options for sending a delegate to investigate the situation were discussed at Assembly, but did not carry the day. There was no mention of this International during either committee discussion, or on the floor of the Assembly, and I don't recall the document speaking of this specifically, either. I would have had no objections to your proposal.

Dundee_United
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Dec 10 2006 23:12

Well that's interesting. Do you think committee members pushing the motion actually understand what the EZLN are up to? Demanding adherence to some document that's really only relevant to Mexico is just fucking daft. The only conceivable reason for adherence would to signify your organisation's commitment to the Zezta International. Attending the meetings and backing decisions taken there does the same job and is less weird in any case.

Skraeling
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Dec 11 2006 00:57
Dundee_United wrote:
Quote:
What is the relationship for this call for an new encuentro vs. neoliberalism and the People's Global Action network?

It isn't an encuentro against neoliberalism. I has nothing to do with the PGA. It's an attempt to form a socialist international. The Sixth declaration was a document aimed at the Mexican Left and a 'Sixth Commission' was formed to build up 'the other campaign' around those who agreed with this document. The Zezta International/Enlace grouping was tasked to work on drawing together the left from the rest of the world to discuss a basis for unity. In Europe basically only liberals have answered this call, so perhaps it will end up as shite as the PGA, but that certainly is not the intention. The intention is quite obviously to build a socialist international. The PGA is not involved with this.

OK, yr obviously reading some other stuff i'm not, its just that reading the initial thing you posted it reads just like another call for an encuentro vs neoliberalism. Can you point me to any websites/documents about them trying to set up a new international?

Caiman del Barrio
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Dec 11 2006 01:04

Double post.

Caiman del Barrio
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Dec 11 2006 01:07
JoeBlack2 wrote:
(BTW the word 'snails' in the document is better translated as 'meeting place')

And "pueblo" in political documents tends to mean "people", not "town" or "village" as a recent Libcom news article would have us believe. wink

*Runs before someone tries to get him to do some work for Libcom*

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Felix Frost
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Dec 11 2006 02:08

There is a better English translation at the EZLN website:
http://www.zeztainternazional.org/esp/el-intergalactico-va/palabra-zapat...
(just scroll down to the bottom)