Gary

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Kidda
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Joined: 30-09-03
Feb 16 2004 06:06
Gary

right quite frankly your whining is really starting to piss me off

get over it lad

You acted like a complete cunt, so we had to act to protect ourselves and the group. Since you have some sort of obsession with us lets get it all out in the open so you can 'relieve' yourself

in the groups email account today

Quote:
You think you are libertarian.

Of course Britain is hardly a haven for freedom but one of the

benefit is a fair trial. Anyone accused of something at least has the

right to defend himself before he is accused.

Unforutately you/vous and the anarchist movement did not even give me

the chance to say a few words to defend myself. The right to provide

the other side of the arguement -> this = justice. In terms of

justice Blair is more libertarian than you/vous and the anarchist

movement.

All i asked for was the right to be heard. I did not get that. Not

fair at all.

You cant even admit that you/vous have been out-of-order.

Of course you dont give a shit about me anymore but just incase you

are interested im joining the left-wing Meretz party of Israel and

moving there in june.

Gary - The only Democracy is Direct Democracy

So come on then

heres your stage

everything out in the open so we can all be held accountable for our actions and our comments just like you were when you decided to support the war in iraq and make homophobic and sexist comments

Moan away

get it out of your system

but please for the love of god do it fucking quickly and then leave us in peace

How strange at a time we get a moaning email from you, the groups email account is signed up to a whole manner of porn sites, mailing lists and Christian teaching sites. Not accusing you. Just stating a fact.

So come on then kid, wow us with your 'defence'

WeTheYouth
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Joined: 16-10-03
Feb 16 2004 11:56

Does he post on here?

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Spartacus
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Feb 16 2004 12:31
Quote:
Does he post on here?

i hope not!

and what's with all the "you/vous"? does he think he'll get me on his side by throwing in bits of french?

as a hatter, that boy, as a hatter...

Kidda
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Feb 16 2004 12:36

does he post here?

well he's been moaning for the best part of a year about wanting to air his voice

here you go

perfect place to do it

he knows this thread is here ive emailed him the link to it

i cant wait to hear this defence he's been dying to get off his chest

twenty-four?

Kidda
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Joined: 30-09-03
Feb 17 2004 02:03

It seems his ego is a bit over inflated and his hobby is now sending us threats

I mean it Gary everything you send me is ending up here

if your to much of a coward to air your 'defence' then thats your problem but at least now the whole world can see how you acted and why we had to take the action we did last year

Quote:
oh sorry - my movement. i started the group with one member - ME

scum

--

you cant start an anarchist group with one member.. It's like trying to start a religion with one believer. and since when has the 'movement' belonged to anyone

Quote:
1. i tried to sign up but my username was deleted

2. i was going to email my views but i needed to know more of what i

was accused of. I asked you but you just forwarded me to the 7 words

on the site

3. saying words like moan are well well out-of-order. i have never

insulted you. no need to insult me.

Im now going to do evevything i can to destoy your movement.

Sign up with a different username then, all the discussion about this should really stay on this thread, its not fair to infect your warped views on others

Read the statement on OUR website, you know full well what you were accused of. You know full well you refused to take a no war but the class war stance with the rest of us, which was fair enough you have every right to do so, but you had no right to make out that we were all supporting the war in Iraq by claiming to speak for WMA rather than yourself on various bulletin boards.

Your views against women were offensive, childish and down right sexist. Your attitude towards the group was shite. Your homophobic comments were infuriating. Your warped opinion of the palestine issue was not compatable with the rest of the group, and most of it went against everything as a group we stood for. You acted like a complete twat once more by directing the website to the IDF, you announced 2 weeks before Mayday that we had 200 members and were looking to start trouble when you know that this wasnt true. need i go on?

3. You have insulted me, my friends, and the group name by acting the way you did. Turn up to the next meeting.

as for the last comment, im taking that as a threat because i know what a complete twat you can be once you get going.

AlexA
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Joined: 16-09-03
Feb 17 2004 11:02

sorry we saw gary register but knew that he had redirect the WMA site to the IDF homepage so he was banned by one of the admins. Apologies, we'll re-allow the username.

Kidda
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Joined: 30-09-03
Feb 17 2004 11:11

He re-emerged on Urban75 over the past couple of days as

Twenty-Four

and has now been banned over there

Gary, in all seriousness your not showing the signs of a happy stable individual

How about you come to a meeting, we talk this over, you get a chance to air your defence once and for all and then we can leave it.

Unfortunatley your views arent compatable with the groups, you know this, we know this, hey half the world does, but if you really feel you need to get it off your chest then do so. Weve said time and time again send us a statement like you had planned and we'd read it and take the time to reply

yet you didnt but still kept sending the emails which quite frankly are just getting weirder by the minute, hence this thread.

maybe its time for you to move on and stop being so bitter

its only an anarchist group, hardly the vehicle for the revolution is it son

Gary_IDF
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Joined: 18-02-04
Feb 18 2004 15:31

Basically I think it is well out-of-order to use insults towards me. Words like moan, cunt etc are below the belt.

You accused me of 4 things - Palestine, War on Iraq, Women, and Arabs.

Well (1)i dont hate Arabs and i dont know why you wud have thought that,

(2)i hate hate Palestinians. (3)i think Saddam had to go and it was beter for the USA to go in than allow Saddam to rule there for another 20years.

On Women; Well i do parly view women as sex objects. NO all the time but when im at bars, clubs and some other occasion. All my friends think the same and i know girls who view men as sex objects.

IDF; Well you and the ANarchists deserved that. You deserved it for not having the guts to tell me to my face that im out of the group. The Anarchist Youth and other groups had a link to the IDF on their site. That was fucking funny. I showed every Jewish guy i know. They all loved it (even the left-wing ones). The Anarchists have moved from being pro-human rights, in to being Pro-Palestinian Nationalists. Its not on and not libertarian.

I dont support the IDF at all but the Kfir-Wearing and the badges wind me up. Two types of people where kfir's Islamic Fascists and Anarchsts. Forwarding to the IDF windeed anarchists up like the Kfir minds me up.

PLEASE dont reply with insults. PLus im willing to defend myself in public at a meeting if you want.

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Ed
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Feb 18 2004 18:43
Quote:
i hate hate Palestinians

How compatible is this with Anarchism, Gary?

Quote:
The Anarchist Youth and other groups had a link to the IDF on their site......The Anarchists have moved from being pro-human rights, in to being Pro-Palestinian Nationalists.

First off, this is contradictory. Why would pro-Palestinian nationalists link to the IDF? Secondly, these are lies. Neither the AYN nor any other anarchist group linked to the IDF. Also, Anarchists aren't Palestinian nationalists. Some may support one, two or no state solutions but I'm yet to meet an Anarcho who supports Hamas, Islamic Jihad, Yasser Arafat or the Palestinian Authority. I, personally, support the Palestinian people in their attempt not to get pushed into The Med and any attempt to dismantle Islamic Fundies and the PA.

Quote:
Forwarding to the IDF windeed anarchists up like the Kfir minds me up.

No, the redirecting the WMA site to the IDF you disrupted the normal running of the group. Does Kfir wearing disrupt the running of your life?

Anyway, please reply to this. Esp. the bit about hating Palestinians. You say you're joining Meretz? I thought you'd prefer to locate the old Kach bunch. Judging by your statements, you and Meir Kahane would get on great roll eyes

Lazlo_Woodbine
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Joined: 26-09-03
Feb 18 2004 18:59

I don't support a Palestinian state. I'm not even sure there's a 'Palestinian nationality' apart from the one that the Israeli's have create over the last 60 or so years. However I do support some people who see themselves as Palestinian. That's a fairly normal anachist position.

Maybe you need to tell us why you hate Palestinians so much, Gary? Even the little ones, even the ones who are pacifists? What have they done to you?

You sometimes see women simply as objects of your desire. Fair enough; but was that all you said? You've not defended yourself against accusations of homohpobia, either...

AlexA
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Feb 18 2004 23:06
Lazlo_Woodbine wrote:
Maybe you need to tell us why you hate Palestinians so much, Gary? Even the little ones, even the ones who are pacifists?

Even the ones who help run this site?

Gary_IDF
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Joined: 18-02-04
Feb 19 2004 02:36

Ridiculous.

This takes the piss and then beyond that for a mile. I did not write i hate hate palestinians. Someone edited my words.

The whole process of me having problems with the Anarchists movement has been via the internet. The internet is not as realible as word of mouth. Gee i wonder how many people have judge me on the basis of what i have (or have not) written on the net.

Gary_IDF
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Joined: 18-02-04
Feb 19 2004 02:42

The fact that Ed believes im some sort of Kahanist proves that people about me certain things which aint true. Infact in France Kahanists beat-up Left-Wing Jews who had a banner on a demo saying; 'IDF OUT OF HEBRON.'

Im extremely extremly against the Hebron settlements and all others in the West Bank/Gaza so i doubt this makes me a Kahaninist.

By i have a very good friend who is a Christian-Palestinian Socialist. Him and his family refuse to wear the Kfir and says that British-Anarchists are stupid for wearing it.

AlexA
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Joined: 16-09-03
Feb 19 2004 02:50

I'll check with the other admins to see if someone could have edited your post. But I strongly suspect you're talking out of your arse.

You also did say on urban75 that WMA supported the war and had 200 members - "practically a mass movement", if I recall correctly...

Gary_IDF
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Joined: 18-02-04
Feb 19 2004 02:55

WHAT THE F**K.

Lazlo wrote that im homophobic. What? How? No!

Im sorry that take it so far away from any kind of reality that i believe that you guys have absolutely no idea about what my beliefs are.

You guys dont know me at all.

Gary_IDF
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Feb 19 2004 03:06
alexa wrote:

You also did say on urban75 that WMA supported the war and had 200 members - "practically a mass movement", if I recall correctly...

Guily for that.

On the 200 thing. Some guy said the cops read this site. So as a joke i said we have 200 to scare the cops. As i recall kidda then said 2000. I assumed that we were preaching to the converted anyway and that as we did not shut-up about the WMA on the net that people wud have known we were joking.

On the war thing. The WMA's views werre different to the STWC. I never said the WMA supported the war. I said that the people in the WMA agreed with what i believed. But i admit that i shud not have said that and i was wrong.

Kidda
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Feb 19 2004 06:51

i said 2000? confused

is that thread still about, that doesnt sound like something i would say.

I joke ALOT on urban75 and always have done but that thing always sticks with me, it was the way you typed it, i remember the onslaught of PM's i had afterwards and me and another member having to defend ourselves like crazy because everyone started to assume that WMA had some very dodgy politics.

I thought long and hard before i posted this thread, the idea of airing our dirty laundry in public didnt really fill me with much joy, but ever since we released that statement and told you we couldnt work with you anymore, weve had a slow build up of emails from you which for the most part ive been the one to deal with, and im sick of it. you just cant leave it. you couldnt just take it as it was and left the group and walked away, you had to keep sending more and more abusive emails and quite frankly its not on.

You think we're stupid, you think we dont know whats going on, well i'll tell you now we're not.

Everytime you've tried to join a group since you left us weve heard about it, jesus we've even heard about the emails you sent to Class War about Ms Dynamite being a non anarchist infedel and then you tried to join them, knowing full well that your politics are not anarchist, i dont know what they are im not to sure there is a 'fucked up' category, but they are certainly not anarchist.

Im glad that you've shown your true colours on this thread because then maybe people who doubted us before and said it wasnt necessary to take the actions we did can see just a small amount of what weve had to deal with. And remember the emails i put up and addressed on this thread are the tame ones, ive still got the emails you sent us all those months ago. There is a lot more i could have said.

I dont know whats going on in your personal life or where your head is at the moment, but all the signs are showing it is not in a good place. Gary for your sake please think about talking to someone, fighting your way around the UK joining anarchist group after anarchist group after you've said yourself your not an anarchist is not a good way to live your life. It will just result with you becoming more bitter and resentfull. making enemys is never better than making friends.

Our views on the war were different to the local STWC because we took a No War but the Class war stance and backed off from the ins and outs of the local organising because it was all SWP backed. The local STWC started linking arms with local fundamental muslims, were not talking local religious people were talking fundamental, those same people nearly attacked us on the March1st demo because they took offence to us taking the piss out of Osama Bin Laden, those were not the type of people we wanted to associate ourselves with. You on the other hand supported the war which you have every right to do so, what you had no right to do was to claim WMA supported your view because we didnt, we did not support the war in Iraq we did not support George Bush but to you that meant we supported Saddam, it doesnt and we dont.

Theres a difference between viewing women as attractive and then viewing them as mearly sex objects, you forgot to defend yourself about the homophobic comments, if i recall correctly at the time some of them were directed at me, which is why they stand out in my mind.

As for the middle east issues you all should know MY opinion on it, i cant speak for the group because its such a sensitive issue it wouldnt be right to. I dont see people as being either 'palestinian' or 'israeli' i see them as human beings and everytime a human being dies out there because of this conflict i feel it, not because its a palestinian kid dying because a solider shoot him in Rafah or a mother being blown up on a bus, but because a human being lost their life. I dont blame either of the people on the sides of this conflict i blame their governments, i blame this system that uses working class people as toys to play their little games, a system that seperates people and tells them that were all different and that its a bad thing, a system that wont let us be free as we should and a system that trys to shut us up everytime we cry out and say its not fair.

everytime someone dies out there its a fucking injustice, it matters not if they are palestinian or israeli to me, i support working class people fighting against their oppressors, but thats not to say i support working class people killing working class people, though in some cases i can see why they would feel they had no choice but to.

my personal feeling is that we should stop trying to work out which side were on and rather how we can fight the real enemy out there, and the real enemy out there isnt a woman on a bus, or a man hidden in a bullet filled house surrounded by tanks, its the people who think they have the power to control us the people who think they have the right to call themselves 'leaders'.

people havent judged you soley on what you have written on the net, they've judged you on your actions as well. I cant ever remember a time that i could see you really felt comfortable in WMA and often wondered why you were in the group. You never hung around after meetings, you never came to socials with us, you never even just came out for a pint and a chat, you spent half of your time keeping the group at arms length, it always struck me asbeing very odd. Why get involved if you didnt want to get involved and then moan that we were involving you enough?

I dont wear a Kfir badge, yeah i wear a Class war one but thats about it. o and a juggling one, but we wont talk about that cos i'll get lynched.

What i dont understand is why the neeed for all this

I know if it was me and id been told i wasnt compatable with the group LAST JUNE, i would have accepted that and moved on. I wouldnt pop up everynow and then with threatening emails and malicious actions, i wouldnt be running around the country trying to join other anarchist groups, i wouldnt be holding such a grudge against something that in the great scheme of things doesnt really matter.

It's just an anarchist group, its not the be all and end all, it shouldnt be. if WMA collpases tomorrow it wouldnt be such a bad thing because its just a name its just a label, whats more important are the people in it. Its members. I respect them all a hell of a lot, weve all got different experiences, weve all been through different things, but i know that if i had an idea for something i could take it tothe group and they would help me with it. (hopefully) they wouldnt help me because it could raise the profile of the label WMA or make them feel better, they would help me because they are anarchists to and thats what were meant to do, no matter what the problem is if we can help sort it we should, thats how humanity works. This system will never stop us, it might stop labels it might break down groups but as history shows peoples thirst for freedom is bigger than anything the system could lay at our feet, so because of that we'll keep plodding along and we'll keep helping in the ways we can, and we'll keep fighting. and in my opinion thats how it should be. But you were never a team player, you never wanted to be like that. You saw yourself as important and not the rest of us. Why?

Quote:
Im now going to do evevything i can to destroy your movement.

You cant. You'll never be able to. Stop being such a child. you can troll on urban as much as you like. You can send me as many threatning emails as you like. You can kick and scream like a toddler having a tantrum. but when alls said and done, this ''movement'' cant be destroyed by one individual with a bruised ego. Your an idiot if you think you can.

Ok, so ive been as calm as i could in answering your posts. Ive tried to address everything. I hope you and other people are a bit more clearer in how we/i stand in the situation. But looking back on everything thats happened in the past year, i doubt i'll ever be able to understand your reasoning behind all this.

Gary_IDF
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Joined: 18-02-04
Feb 19 2004 16:09

All i have asked to do is the chance to defend myself.

Justice = giving two sides. All i ever wanted was the chance to give my side of the story. I dont think 'being heard' is too much to ask.

I have been accused of being many things. These things are untrue so im defending myself.

You claim to be somehow morally superior to me. Well i think if you were accused of being a homophobic racist then i think you wud want to defend yourself, right?

Kidda
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Feb 19 2004 16:25

JESUS CHRIST WITH KNOBS ON

what the fuck do you think this thread is about if not a place for you to air your defence

what planet are you on?

roll eyes

WeTheYouth
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Feb 19 2004 16:43
Kidda wrote:
JESUS CHRIST WITH KNOBS ON

what the fuck do you think this thread is about if not a place for you to air your defence

what planet are you on?

roll eyes

Zorgonia...... black bloc

libcom.org
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Feb 20 2004 04:30

No one edited Gary's post - it did say "I hate hate Palestinians".

*Maybe* it was a typo... but we just got this PM from Gary:

"Victory to the IDF!"

He obviously has a sense of humour. And some severe emotional problems.

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Spartacus
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Feb 20 2004 13:24
Gary_IDF wrote:
All i have asked to do is the chance to defend myself.

Justice = giving two sides. All i ever wanted was the chance to give my side of the story. I dont think 'being heard' is too much to ask.

right, well you've had that. now can you please piss off and leave the anarchist movement alone? you do realise that if you had reacted sensibly and politely back in june we'd probably have taken that statement off by now, but as you have shown yourself to be intent on disrupting anarchist groups we've had to keep it to warn others. surely you can find something better to do than argue pointlessly on webboards with people you know you will never agree with.

Da_Original_Dis...
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Feb 26 2004 18:41
Quote:
No one edited Gary's post

No, but somones edited mine tho. I can edit my own posts thank you very much! neutral

Kidda
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Feb 26 2004 20:45

yeah but not whilst your at work aye son

two_hundred_and_24
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Jul 11 2004 19:49

I saw the front page of your website.

It says; last updated 01/03/2004.

You can say what ever you want about me but that makes no difference to the pathetic fact that your website has not been updated for 5months.

I can guarenntee that your group is not going to have any influence on society in both the short and long term.

Furthermore - I recon by 2006 the group will have dispanded totally.

Gary,

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Spartacus
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Jul 12 2004 12:56

strangely enough gary, the internet is not actually the real world, and just because we've not put anything on the website recently doesn't mean we haven't been doing anything...

Quote:
Furthermore - I recon by 2006 the group will have dispanded totally.

yet by then i reckon you still won't have grown up, or learnt to spell...

lets_make_a_stand
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Jul 15 2004 13:50

who is gary? and most importantly, who does he think he is??

by the looks of it, not an anarchist.

Quote:
Im now going to do evevything i can to destroy your movement.

go ahead, failing at this would make you realize alot about yourself

Kidda
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Joined: 30-09-03
Jul 15 2004 22:48

Oh

FOR

FUCK

SAKE

GIVE IT A FUCKING REST

Quote:
It says; last updated 01/03/2004.

thats because some of us are out in the real world doing stuff. maintaining a website and doing a few publicity stunts that we can attach ''WMA'' to are way down on the list of important stuff.

we dont need to feel self important by making WMA a brand name. grafting where its needed has done us well.

you on the other hand, are a complete cunt who cant let the past go. get a grip.