Submitted by Mike Harman on May 25, 2018

Split from: https://libcom.org/forums/theory/poverty-identity-politics-21052018?page=2

Noa Rodman

More recently perhaps is the Assange afffair. Perhaps he is just a libertarian, and not a real socialist, but why don't we see more defence of him, is winning his freedom also not an important reform?

Fleur

I personally hope that all of Julian Assange's limbs drop off in a freak complication of vitamin D deficiency.
Also, we should oppose all antisemiticism, I can't believe that they is any kind of legitimate argument otherwise.

Fall Back

Noa Rodman

More recently perhaps is the Assange afffair. Perhaps he is just a libertarian, and not a real socialist, but why don't we see more defence of him, is winning his freedom also not an important reform?

No, because he's a rapist. So 'winning his freedom' (cunt is free to leave the embassy any time he likes) exact opposite of a positive socialist reform tbh.

Noa Rodman

Fall Back

Noa Rodman

More recently perhaps is the Assange afffair. Perhaps he is just a libertarian, and not a real socialist, but why don't we see more defence of him, is winning his freedom also not an important reform?

No, because he's a rapist. So 'winning his freedom' (cunt is free to leave the embassy any time he likes) exact opposite of a positive socialist reform tbh.

I missed the memo on that one. Here I was thinking he was framed up for exposing crimes of the US empire.

Fall Back

Well, you were wrong. He fled extradition on rape charges, to Sweden and not the US.

And tbh, given that it's hardly a fringe position, I'd have thought someone would have been better served doing some basic research before declarating a man who fled rape charges to have been fitted up.

Fleur

Nope. He was wanted for rape, he's under a warrant for skipping bail and he has subsequently been hiding in a closet and most likely annoying the fuck out of the poor suffering embassy staff. That was all before he turned full white supremacist. The person you are mistaking him for, who actually exposed American war crimes is Chelsea Manning. Assange's just gained social capital from it.

And if you do not think that the things he openly admitted to doing via his lawyer constitutes rape, then you are a fool and a rape apologist.

Cross-posted with Fall Back.

Fleur

Fall Back:

Don't be silly, we know that Noa doesn't do "basic research."

Noa Rodman

Ok, but let's assume for a moment he's in fact being unjustly persecuted, then you would be fine with organising a struggle for his liberation, which would be actually a struggle for the work that he stands for, namely exposing corporate/government crimes, right?

Fall Back

I don't think it's a particularly useful hypothetical.

A better one might be "was struggling for Chelsea Manning's freedom worth doing", since she literally was imprisoned for "exposing corporate/government crimes".

To which I'd say yes, very much so.

R Totale

Fleur

Nope. He was wanted for rape, he's under a warrant for skipping bail and he has subsequently been hiding in a closet and most likely annoying the fuck out of the poor suffering embassy staff. That was all before he turned full white supremacist. The person you are mistaking him for, who actually exposed American war crimes is Chelsea Manning. Assange's just gained social capital from it.

It's worth noting that, as well as Manning, Jeremy Hammond is a principled anarchist revolutionary with politics a million times better than Assange's who never got a pardon and is still serving a ten-year sentence for actually doing actual hacking of Stratfor, and is far less well-known than the egomaniac hiding out in the embassy - weird how the state didn't need to come up with any convoluted, complex conspiracies to frame either Hammond or Manning, almost as if it had all the laws in place to effectively criminalise wikileaks-type activity in the first place without having to go to a lot of extra effort, isn't it?

Anyway, you can donate to Jeremy here, and if anyone wants to send him a letter, his postal address is
Jeremy Hammond #18729-424
FCI Milan
P.O. Box 1000
Milan, MI 48160
United States

I'm sure he'd love to hear from you.

Noa Rodman

Ok, but let's assume for a moment he's in fact being unjustly persecuted

While we're at it, maybe we should also assume that wishes are horses and the moon is made of green cheese?

Noa Rodman

Fall Back

I don't think it's a particularly useful hypothetical.

A better one might be "was struggling for Chelsea Manning's freedom worth doing", since she literally was imprisoned for "exposing corporate/government crimes".

To which I'd say yes, very much so.

Well it seems there was an incident about this on the Bookfair (I assume the anarchist) in 2013, which connects to our present situation (prompted by an incident at the 2017 Bookfair). The comments on that thread also respond to the "rape apologist" line against Assange defenders:

https://libcom.org/blog/ciaron-o%E2%80%99reilly-julian-assange-chelsea-manning-making-choice-25102013

Just one passage:

You are trying to organise a boycott of the only Manning family support benefit gig there has been in this country. You are trying to STOP people turning out to show their solidarity with Manning and more importantly to offer the very real support of raising money for the Manning family to visit Chelsea. And you are doing this in the name of ‘opposing transphobia’. Genius!

Fleur

Man, that's really scraping the bottom of the barrel when you're trawling through the site quote mining from Ciaron O'Reilly, of all the awful people on this planet.