The Internationalist' Discussion List - Red and Black Notes

Red and Black Notes article about the then new Internationalist' Discussion Network.

Submitted by Fall Back on July 9, 2009

In April 2001, a new discussion network was formed called the Internationalists' Discussion Network (Intsdiscnet/IDN). The impulse to form the network came after the establishment of a similar French-language list in December 2000. The French call was initiated by the Paris Discussion Circle (CDP) a group of former militants of the International Communist Current. On the weekend of April 20-21 2002, comrades gathered in New York city for the first face to face meeting of the English language wing of the network.

Those participating in the network saw a need to address aspects of revolutionary theory and have adopted the following criteria for participation:

1. We are not living the end of history. Liberal capitalism and its political expression, democracy, is not the terminus, the finally achieved form of human history. The capitalist mode of production, like all those that have preceded it, is not eternal.

2. This world system is not reformable; it cannot be transformed gradually via trade unionism or bourgeois democracy. It must be overturned from top to bottom.

3. Internationalism is a condition sine qua non for belonging to the network. Real communism can only be envisaged on a planetary scale. Today, as yesterday, "the workers of the world must unite." They have no country.

4. Denunciation of all false communisms USSR, China, Cuba, etc. For a classless, moneyless, wageless, stateless society.

5. Finally, we must respect a revolutionary ethic. This implies, without concession, intellectual honesty, tolerance and the rejection of insults. It outlaws any idea of manipulation in the name of tactics.

The New York meeting set itself two tasks for discussion, imperialism and functioning within the network.

In the months prior to the meeting a number of comrades wrote documents addressing the theory of imperialism and its application today. Many of those present at the conference felt that the "classical" models of imperialism, such as those developed by Lenin and Luxemburg were inadequate to explain the contemporary world, even if aspects of their theories were still important.

As such, the discussion on imperialism touched upon the events of September 11 and the War in Afghanistan, the Balkan Wars, the middle east, the EU vs. The US, and the "Empire" thesis as proposed by Antonio Negri and Michael Hardt. While some participants in the network see a tendency in the direction proposed in Empire, participants at the conference agreed that capital is ultimately unable to overcome its national framework.

The second day of the conference was given over to discussions of functioning, and to facilitate future discussions it was decided to set up a three- person technical commission. Also dealt with under this point were matters of disruption to the flow of discussion and ways to expand the network. Since the network is not a proto-party or recruiting forum it was considered important that the network remain open to a wide range of views.

The participants in the English list are spread over a wide geographical area, but it was decided to continue to hold conferences, as all thought the experience very valuable. The next English language conference has been tentatively scheduled for next year in New York.

Information about the list can be obtained on the net at http//groups.yahoo.com/group/intsdiscnet/. or by sending a blank e-mail to intsdiscnet- [email protected]. If you do not have e- mail access, please write to the R&BN address.

First Published in Red and Black Notes #15, summer 2002, this article has been archived on libcom.org from the Red and Black Notes website.

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Submitted by Juan Conatz on June 6, 2024

Curious if anyone who still posts or lurks here attended the Prague antiwar conference a few weeks ago?

The AnarCom Network, which I assume is some kind of split from an existing UK group, published this account which mainly describes some intense conflict between the antiwar attendees and I presume anarchists who are in favor of Ukraine national self-defense?

https://anarcomuk.uk/2024/05/28/prague-congress-interim-report/

I haven't seen any other reportbacks or statements. I saw syndicalist, who I'm not sure if he still posts here, looking for more elsewhere, as well.

ZJW

2 years 4 months ago

Submitted by ZJW on June 7, 2024

Complementary to what AnarCom said, see the second to the last paragraph in this statement by KRAS: https://t.ly/6d1X0 .

ZJW

2 years 4 months ago

Submitted by ZJW on June 7, 2024

From before the event took place,

an interview with the organising committee:
https://actionweek.noblogs.org/interview-with-the-organising-committee-of-the-action-week

a list of groups planning to take part (as of 15 May):
https://actionweek.noblogs.org/list-of-participants-at-aw2024

Despite the fact that organising committee said 'we didn’t invite any of the most “famous” so-called “left-communist” big organizations existing since decades and often identifying themselves as the “revolutionary milieu” [...]', the CWO/ICT apparently did attend, or planned to, in this manner:

‘Some organisations who are in NWBCW [the No War but the Class War Initiative] like members of the AnarCom Network (ACN) and the Anarchist Communist Group (ACG), have been specifically invited to Prague. Others have not, including the Internationalist Communist Tendency (ICT), yet we shall be present alongside the other comrades as we accept all eight points of the invitation. It is in this spirit that we attend the Prague Week of Action which we hope will be a success and open out to other internationalist initiatives in an attempt to draw us all closer together.’

(Quote above from the CWO article ‘To the Internationalists Attending the Prague Week of Action’ at https://www.leftcom.org/en/articles/2024-05-01/to-the-internationalists-attending-the-prague-week-of-action )

Alf

2 years 4 months ago

Submitted by Alf on June 7, 2024

I was there as part of an ICC delegation. We will publish an article on what happened

ZJW

2 years 4 months ago

Submitted by ZJW on June 10, 2024

At the same Leftcom url given above, there is now, under their initial article, comment by the ICT (/CWO) on what transpired in Prague. The first paragraph is simply about the organisational/venue chaos and eventual division into two different congresses. This has already been noted by others. But the second two paragraphs are of political content:

'From a political point of view, the real divide that emerged was between the activists who were looking for immediate solutions on how to stop the war, and those with a class struggle orientation who had a more long term perspective and understood wars, as a product of the capitalist system, can only be ended by the mass struggle of workers.

However, it wasn't all a waste of time. Over the week, many good conversations were had (particularly in smaller groups, in pubs, cafes, etc.). Experiences were shared and links were made between organisations and individuals from many different countries. Above all, seeing internationalists of various tendencies join forces to basically improvise their own congress was heartening. We all tried to make the best of a bad situation and it drew us closer together. In that sense, we are glad we went.'

ZJW

2 years 4 months ago

Submitted by ZJW on June 10, 2024

Link to KRAS article given above has 'expired'. A working link: https://shorturl.at/IUiJB .

Alf

2 years 4 months ago

Submitted by Alf on June 10, 2024

This is the ICC's article: "Activism is a barrier to political clarification":
https://en.internationalism.org/content/17524/activism-barrier-political-clarification