10-Point Program of the Catalan CNT

Picket in Olot, Catalonia, during the Catalan General Strike of 2017.

Twice in the last year, the anarcho-syndicalist CNT of Spain has led general strikes which had a massive following, despite the abstention or active sabotage of the business unions. With the deepening crisis in Catalonia, and the CNT's growing legitimacy, they have put forward a program to mobilize and unify action.

Originally posted in English at From the Ashes.

Introduction:

We have translated this program that the CNT (a revolutionary union in Spain) is putting forward as a solution for the current political and economic crisis in Catalonia. We think this program is important for revolutionaries in other countries to engage with because of the unique situation in Catalonia, and of the CNT and the other radical unions there. The problems in Catalonia are different in many ways from the ones we see in North America, and not everything can (or should) be copied over without context. Several of the proposals, in fact, may not make sense for North America. This is appropriate - when revolutionaries are in a position to actually influence the course of events, they need to know how to make their principles present “in the workplaces and the streets", as this program attempts to. That will always look different based on the local context.

Twice in the last year, the CNT (along with other radical unions) has led general strikes which had a massive following, despite the abstention or active sabotage of the Spanish business unions: the Catalan general strike against state repression in October 2017, and then the Feminist General Strike on March 8 of this year. The radical unions, the CNT and CGT in particular, are successfully becoming a major point of reference for the working class in Spain, especially the most combative sections of it.[i] This program isn't just words on a screen - it is meant to be a weapon, and there is a real chance it could actually be taken up by workers in large in large numbers to mobilize and unite their struggles.

The political crisis in Catalonia would make it very easy for revolutionaries to be disoriented by a wave of nationalism, and either stay silent, or speak without saying anything useful. This program from the Catalan CNT is a very concrete attempt to propose a path forward that is based on common class interests rather than nationalism. It contains specific proposals that can mobilize multiple distinct sections of the working class that have their own distinct challenges, such as working women or agrarian workers, and lead to a unity in struggle that recognizes and addresses those unique challenges.

It's also important to remember that the CNT operates from the bottom-up, without any experts planning out their strategy from above. This program was developed and proposed by rank-and-file members in one branch, and was then discussed and modified by all of the other members in Catalonia through their branches before being collectively adopted. This is exactly how revolutionary unions should develop their programs, rather than (for example) endless debates on social media that lead nowhere.

- Wobblies for a Revolutionary Union Movement

Spanish Version - Original Catalan Version
 

Faced with the current political situation in Catalonia and everything that has happened recently, the union branches of the CNT in Catalonia and the Balearic Islands understand that:

  • We need to make sure that our anarcho-syndicalist principles are present in the street, so that they give us credibility and legitimacy among our class, the working class. That is why we won't let any political parties make decisions for us, nor will we let them cover the struggle of the Catalan people in their flags. If we want to be taken seriously, we need to put forward proposals which are credible, possible, and above all useful - in the street, and in the workplaces.
  • The problems that we, the people of Catalonia, are facing today must be fought and dealt with by us, without anybody else telling us what to do. We have to make it clear for the people in Catalonia that the Catalan problem requires an internationalist and anti-statist solution. We can't fall into xenophobia, or into promises of better states within the capitalist regime.
  • The "Catalan problem" is actually all of Spain's problem. It's a unique opportunity to overturn the "Regime of '78"[ii]; we are the only ones that have the legitimacy to speak against this regime. We were the only ones who didn't sign their conciliation treaties, and we are the only ones who never stopped denouncing the pseudo-democratic mafia which has been governing us for the last 40 years.
  • For us, workplace organizing is a means, not an end. Our goal is the social revolution which will completely overturn the current socioeconomic order. We support the Catalan population in its current demands as a population and a society, insofar as we form a part of this population and this society. Once these goals have been achieved, we will continue working for our ultimate objectives.

 

With this understood, we declare that:

We only want a republic if it is social and anarchist, based in the self-management of the means of production, distribution, and consumption. The Catalan population's aspiration towards self-determination and social justice is only possible if we have a class perspective, and a focus on creating the structures of self-management that help prepare the working classes to construct the society we desire.

The union branches of the CNT of Catalonia want to make very clear that we remain firm in our commitment to the work that we consider essential to progress, the defense of the rights and freedoms of the working class, and the Social Revolution. Therefore, we are publicizing a 10-point program, which we will continue to develop from our union branches. We will also work to create public platforms to support the achievement of this program. This is the only way we will win improvements for the working classes.

1) Direct development of permanent jobs

In private enterprises and public administrations, as a general rule, all contracts will be indefinite and full-time. In cases where a business wants to contract workers in another way, this will be discussed and agreed to with the union representations (Union Sections) which are present in the workplace. The unitary representations (works councils or staff delegates) will be excluded from these negotiations.[iii]

2) Development of a regular work day

Complete elimination of extra hours. Complete elimination of the irregular distribution of the workday. If a business or public administration claims the need to restructure from a normal workday, they will have to discuss it with the union branches which have a presence in the workplace. The state-sponsored representations (works councils and staff delegates) will be excluded from these negotiations.

3) New general minimum wage

Establishment of a new minimum wage of 1,200 Euros per month for all workers in public administrations or private companies.

4) Action Plan for Equality

Elimination of all categories in collective bargaining agreements which cover up offering working women positions with worse salary conditions than their male colleagues. All working women will immediately be transferred to the appropriate salary category.

5) Factory closures

Faced with factory closures: recovery, transformation, and worker's self-management.

6) Confederal Employment Plans

Out of the union branches, we envision the creation of:

  • Cooperative projects of production and consumption, in the city as well as the country.
  • Hiring halls for people without work, in the city as well as the country.

We will tend to their promotion and creation, as well as establishing contact with other cooperative projects that share interests. This will help towards the creation of a united platform for mobilization, oriented towards relieving the situation of people without work.

7) Comprehensive health reform

We propose: Establishment of technical associations to manage the health centers (hospitals and primary care) with the participation of members of the Popular Assembly, in the city as well as the country. These Popular Assemblies might already exist, they might be Associations of Neighbors, they might be created by the unions to fill this role, or they might be a fusion of all of these, resulting from the unitary platforms for mobilization which were mentioned earlier.[iv]

8) Comprehensive Educational Reform

We propose: Defense of the linguistic immersion model which is the current norm in Catalonia, which we consider unifying and progressive. Creation and promotion of free school projects by any means which are available (renting, buying, occupying...), on the part of the unitary platforms of mobilization (popular assemblies) in the city as well as the country. Active participation by the popular assemblies in the development of blueprints for turning the current public schools into truly free schools.

9) Comprehensive Agrarian Reform

We propose: Abolition of the special Social Security system in the country; all workers are equal. Immediate affirmative action in health and education with the cities. Promotion of cooperative work. Promotion of a change in the structure of farming, to adapt it to high quality and agro-ecological forms. Promotion of distribution and exchange networks.

10) Structures of Self-Management

The unitary platforms of mobilization (or the union branches of the CNT in areas where these platforms don't yet exist) which have already taken up education and health as areas of work according to the above proposals, should also become involved in housing and energy poverty. This is how we will continue to prepare and ready ourselves to take on ever more issues which put us on the road to self-management, which is exactly the type of society which we wish to live in.
Adopted in Olot, Catalonia, April 11, 2018
 

 

[i] The CNT and CGT both lay reference to the historical anarchosyndicalist (revolutionary unionist) movement in Spain. They have different approaches to Spanish labor law, and did not work closely together for a long time, but since the economic crisis hit Spain in 2008, they have begun to forge a working unity in struggle, most recently exemplified during the Catalan General Strike in 2017 and then the Feminist General Strike in 2018.

[ii] The “Regime of ‘78” refers to the system that was set up after the death of the dictator, Francisco Franco. From the perspective of the CNT and other revolutionaries, the so-called ‘transición’ (transition to democracy) was really just a ‘traición’(betrayal).

[iii] In Spain, each worker has a contract (or is supposed to) which regulates their work. “Union sections” are branches of workers at a particular workplace, and form the basis of the CNT’s strategy for dealing with Spanish labor law. “Works councils” are government-supported and -financed bodies at large workplaces based on voting for representatives every 4 years – the CNT rejects these bodies and calls on all workers to organize without them.

[iv] Popular Assemblies became very popular in Spain after the M15 movement in 2011. Similar to General Assemblies in North America, they are mass meetings which allow everyone present to speak. Associations of Neighbors are legacies of neighborhood-level mobilizations from the 60s and 70s.

Posted By

OliverTwister
Apr 27 2018 19:46

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  • The "Catalan problem" is actually all of Spain's problem. It's a unique opportunity to overturn the "Regime of '78"; we are the only ones that have the legitimacy speak against this regime.

    CNT

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Comments

melenas
Apr 28 2018 10:54

Very interesting. For this are the agreements of congresses, to have a base to position the union in struggles and to offer a revolutionary strategy to the working class.

akai
Apr 28 2018 14:35

It would be nice if the working class came up with strategy for themselves and overthrew the vanguard cliques which have led them away from truly revolutionary positions.

Ragnar
Apr 28 2018 15:30

A great document, puts in a program for the present moment the agreements emanated in the congresses. It also marks a revolutionary position, a working class, labor, economic and social approach. It also generates discourse, makes other union, social and political actors position themselves.

Spikymike
Apr 28 2018 17:52

What exactly does ''We support the Catalan population in it's current demands....'' etc actually mean?

Is this radical reform programme aimed at a social republic specifically for Catalonia rather than for Spain or a wider area?

Ragnar
Apr 28 2018 18:12
Quote:
What exactly does ''We support the Catalan population in it's current demands....'' etc actually mean?

the possibility of self-determination and decide how to organize the economy and politics in Catalunya. As anarcho-syndicalists we have proposals, ways of thinking, where to get it and what is the real self-determination going through the social revolution. As they explain it in the program.

The program is taken from the congress agreements of the CNT, it is a program that serves the whole Spanish territory. In this case, the regional confederation of CNT in Catalonia and the Balearic Islands has published the agreements in a program format, in such a way that they can influence with them the labor and social struggle processes in a region (Catalonia) that has a population in agitation (many of them working class, to whom this program specifically goes)

akai
Apr 28 2018 18:38

SpikyMike, that's a very good question. And I don't think that the revolution they have in mind is really in the direct of internationalism and anarcho-communism.

OliverTwister
Apr 29 2018 05:02
akai wrote:
It would be nice if the working class came up with strategy for themselves and overthrew the vanguard cliques which have led them away from truly revolutionary positions.

Or do they just need better vanguards from Warsaw?

akai
Apr 29 2018 07:00

Don't think anybody needs vanguards, whereever they' re from.

Ragnar
Apr 29 2018 10:25

Akai, your opinion is funny, how does the working class create a revolutionary opinion for themselves? through their class organizations, right?. the CNT as part of the conscious working class develops a revolutionary program to advance towards the social revolution, part of that program is tried to start up nowadays in the fights in the companies or next to social movements like the one that carried out the 8M. Where is the minority, small and tiny vanguard party that only theorizes?

I hope that your hatred towards CNT does not cloud your mind too.

akai
Apr 29 2018 16:22

My mind is very clear.

Red Marriott
Apr 29 2018 18:04
Quote:
The movement that displays the most abundant signs of decomposition is anarchism, which is hardly even the shadow of its former self. It has succumbed to every reactionary ideology and its disarray is so profound that nothing could have been expected from it but that it would serve as the pimp of sovereignty, the spearhead of vulgar trade unionism, the exponent of apocryphal identities and the mouthpiece of postmodernism. These roles will only serve as temporary stepping stones towards more highly paid activities, integrated into the dominant system, such as social economy, institutional environmentalism, civil society politics or populist nationalism. In the past, anarchism always existed in symbiosis with the workers movement, to which it contributed ideals, and often enough, courage. Any anarchist from that era would have said that nationalism was nothing but an attempt by the bourgeoisie to divide the proletariat; that the nationalist conflict was a false conflict (Madrid-Catalonia, central state-Catalonian people) whose purpose was to conceal the real conflict (bourgeoisie-proletariat); that the issue was not nationality, but anti-capitalism; that the real colonized and oppressed people were not the Catalonians, but the workers; that the workers have neither a fatherland nor a State. In the anarchist press of the past we easily find analyses of nationalism from a class point of view. And in practice, anarchists were frequently engaged in conflicts, often bloody ones, with nationalists. The line separating anarchism from nationalism was well-defined, and this is what today’s pro-sovereignty movement has succeeded in erasing. The pro-sovereignty movement, by setting itself up as the principal social and political force, has polarized society, obliging all the other forces to define themselves in relation to it, for or against, that is, to take sides. The pro-sovereignty caste is the only caste with an explicit project for a “State” and a “country”, and this is why it was easy for it to outflank the civil society “left” and render it impotent. It knows what it does not want and where it wants to go, even if it does not have a very clear idea of how to get there. And while the genuine civil society movement tries to remain above all “blocs” with increasingly higher doses of ambiguity, most anarchists have jumped aboard the pro-sovereignty bandwagon with the fatuous hope of finding cracks in its edifice where they can promote their social causes and identity issues.

Anarchism has lost its “bond” with the workers, but it seems to have discovered a solid enough connection with nationalism. The rights of labor have joined forces with the liberty of peoples, and ballots have joined forces with direct action. Anarchism has converged with the Catalonian Left in the Committees for the Defense of the Referendum, first, and then with the Committees for the Defense of the Republic, becoming esoteric and populist, since it defends an illusory “people” and fights on behalf of a phantom State. It is prepared to serve as the cannon fodder for the pro-sovereignty movement, that is, for a fraction of the bourgeoisie. The CNT and the CGT themselves have university professors serving as the general secretaries of their organizations; the crème de la crème of the citizenry direct these organizations that have nothing anarchosyndicalist about them except their names. And the worst thing of all is that libertarian reformism and pro-sovereignty have not given rise to an extreme left that would seek to draw clarifying lines in the anarchist movement. The latter is not capable of such a thing, and is no longer capable of conceiving a social project that is clearly demarcated from the pro-sovereignty and civil society movements. It is not capable of constituting itself as a radical social current distinct from the other substitutes for such a current such as the CUP, Podemos or Los Comunes. The neo-anarchist ideology revolves around the concept of “the people”, an idea borrowed from primitive bourgeois nationalism. “The people”, however, is not a political subject, much less a class distinct from the bourgeoisie, a socially homogeneous and unified majority that fights for liberation and to construct a State that would guarantee its liberty. It is indeed true that there is no revolutionary subject, since there is no workers movement that could perform such a role. But there is no Catalonian people, either; what is called by that name is only the product of the institutional propaganda of the pro-sovereignty movement, a submissive mass of voters related to one another virtually through social networks and apps on their smart phones, rather than the manifestation of an independent will emanating from a collectivity that is conscious of its past, forged with direct relations and real common interests. In the final analysis, the Catalonian people is an entelechy by means of which the pro-sovereignty caste turns itself into a national class and constitutes itself as a nation, for which purpose it only lacks its own State. Patriotism is a statist religion. This is the reality that lies behind the alleged “sovereign people”: a public relations image, an abstraction that leads to other abstractions like “fatherland”, “nation”, “democracy” or “State”. A myth that allows a few clever social climbers to speak in its name and to claim its institutions as their own patrimony, for their own personal advancement. In a world of full-blown globalized capitalism, there are only exploiters and exploited, whether or not they are Catalonians, there are only a ruling class and the ruled classes; there are only leaders and led, oppressed masses and the State, and there is room only for nationalist false consciousness or revolutionary class consciousness, for narrow-minded patriotism or the universal ideals of emancipation. There is nothing to be expected from the fatherland but abstract liberties, ruled over by a privileged caste; real liberties will be the product of a class struggle prosecuted to its ultimate consequences. http://libcom.org/library/catalonian-affair-miguel-amor-s#new

Ragnar
Apr 29 2018 20:20

So... apart from putting abstract ideas of Miguel Amorós. Any objection to the proposals of the program? because I don´t see them in what you say.
By the way, one among other lies of the text, CNT has a general officer who works in the metal sector and the general officer of CNT in Catalonia is a waiter by profession. They are not university professors like Amorós who, apart from being an academic, has not known what the workers' struggle is for many years.

Red Marriott
Apr 29 2018 21:26

The CNT program carefully tries to accommodate both nationalism & leftism - it describes the working class as their constituency within "the struggle of the Catalan people" - ie, The Nation - opportunistically pretending that there can be a national solution that positively accommodates all presently active forces; whatever happened to the syndicalism/industrial unionism of “the working class and the employing class have nothing in common”? Sold down the river... “we, the people of Catalonia” are identified as the agent of change with workers as a component of that category.

If it had any real guts and clarity it would come out and openly break with the nationalists and criticise their bourgeois role and statist goals. But that would lose the CNT some popularity so they play the populist game instead, hoping to get a seat at the nationalist table or within its future regime. They've learnt nothing since 1936 and once again seek accommodation with a bourgeois state and its reformism. The rank opportunism of such an approach is unfortunately not surprising. ''We support the Catalan population in it's current demands....'' – yes, ‘we’re all in it together’ in a cosy cross-class national unity.

Quote:
We support the Catalan population in its current demands as a population and a society, insofar as we form a part of this population and this society. Once these goals have been achieved, we will continue working for our ultimate objectives.

So national state-building is supported as a transitional demand that supposedly brings the anti-statist social revolution closer. Pitiful...

Ragnar continues his usual populist line;

Quote:
he possibility of self-determination and decide how to organize the economy and politics in Catalunya. As anarcho-syndicalists we have proposals, ways of thinking, where to get it and what is the real self-determination going through the social revolution. As they explain it in the program.

... “self-determination” being generally understood as national independence and state formation. No anarchism to be seen there, just a deliberate opportunist vagueness on the state question. A familiar question arises; how does helping strengthen the state lead to ‘anarcho-syndicalist’ social revolution? Anachro-swyndicalism at work.

Ragnar wrote:
They are not university professors like Amorós who, apart from being an academic, has not known what the workers' struggle is for many years.

He knows the workers struggle has nothing to do with opportunist nationalism. But just because someone has had books published doesn’t make them an academic. Amoros was jailed under Franco and then exiled and has been involved for decades in numerous working class struggles. He has previously stated in 2016 he’s an elementary school teacher, never been an academic - https://libcom.org/library/interview-ruta-66-miguel-amor%C3%B3s
https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miguel_Amor%C3%B3s
so you apparently know little, if anything about him; but that won’t stop you trying to smear him. I hope that your hatred towards critics of the statism of the CNT does not cloud your mind too much.

Ragnar
Apr 29 2018 22:14

hehehe You follow with the straw doll, that if CNT defends statism, that if CNT supports an opportunistic nationalism ... in all the writing there is no proposal that means a support to that. Besides that you continue without making a criticism to the 10 points of the program, then they will be fine and since you can not criticize them, you look for an argument to use to talk about other things that they do not defend.

Red Marriott
Apr 29 2018 23:52

Your dismissals, as usual, have no specifics nor substance. You're unfortunately typical of the dregs of modern anarcho-reformism; Corbynism, Rojava etc.

Battlescarred
Apr 30 2018 09:50

Unfortunately Miguel Amoros himself, whilst offering some valid criticisms of much of present day anarchism is as much part of these "dregs" as those he criticises. I quote: "But it is clear that there are two factors that must be taken into account for the creation of a revolutionary subject that would take shape in a separate world within this world: those who have been excluded from the labor market, or the self-marginalized; those who, although they have not been excluded, abandon the labor market and choose to live on the margins; and the non-industrialized peasant classes. The traditional peasant classes, not just indigenous peoples, but also homesteaders or settlers, those who till land in common, or simply farmers, the landless, or those with land, with only a little land … they are the fulcrum of the defense of the territory, the class struggle of the 21st century."

Spikymike
Apr 30 2018 10:30

Personally I have found Amoros analysis and commentary on much of modern capitalism pretty insightful but have struggled a bit to get my head round his references to defence of 'territory' as I questioned in his text here, https://libcom.org/library/civil-society-plague-middle-class-its-discontents.
Presumably he has a view of the potential revolutionary subject as being a wider dispossessed category than the more narrowly defined waged working class (which deserves a more critical consideration). Battlescarred quote above would fit into Amoros understanding and sympathy/support for the French ZAD popular with many other anarchists. Maybe Battlescarred and the ACG would find some of his contributions more relevant however to their interest in questions of land ownership and control?

Red Marriott
Apr 30 2018 10:41

Thanks, Battlescarred & Spiky. I don't know Amoros's views on peasants, territory etc. and only refer to his comments on the Catalonia situation. Obviously that doesn't mean I have to 100% support all he says on every topic.

Ragnar
Apr 30 2018 12:30

I don´t dismiss anything. What I'm not going to do is debate something that does not happen in the program text, there is no support for nationalism or the state, those baguedades that avail themselves with the same use from the First International (in Spain) of words as people = working classes (proletariat, peasantry and craftsmen). I'm not going to try to convince you either, I don´t need it or it's my interest. I only wonder about the objections to the program, in that sense you don´t have any, which I like to know.

Amorós considered him an academicist in the same vein as, for example, Carlos Taibo. That is, his only activity is to talk about his books. Amoros for me is not someone to take into account because it is anti-unionist and even anti-anarchosyndicalist if you put into practice their theories, their search for the marginal as a revolutionary subject or an anti-developmentalism (I think it has another word in English for it) could have some sense for me in terms of general criticism on the territorial issue, the use of natural resources and environmentalism, but na more. Maybe you like this collective http://contraeldiluvio.es/. Apart from that Amoros is an individual who has lost popularity for 10 years within the considered Spanish anarchist "ghetto"

Spikymike
Apr 30 2018 12:55

I maybe misunderstanding the 10-point programme above but apart from it's questionable territorial framework it appears to be a series of reforms within the framework of capitalism that are hoped to be implemented by a mix of concessions extracted through organised struggle from employers and the state and some union supported co-operative enterprises? It is not clear to what extent these have been assessed as practicable survivable measures in the context of both the global nature of modern capitalism or the current stage of the economic crisis of that system?

syndicalist
Apr 30 2018 18:27

Like or hate it, it's an interesting and telling document

OliverTwister
Apr 30 2018 20:30

@syndicalist, can you say more about what you think are the implications of the document? I'd be interested to get your read on it.

@Spikymike, the proposal was originally made via an assembly of one branch and was debated there, then each other branch debated it at their own assembly, then there was a meeting of delegates from different branches which carried their branch mandates and agreed on a final version. Presumably, during those many discussions, involving at least 100's of people, one of the things they discussed was whether these are "practicable survivable measures in the context of both the global nature of modern capitalism or the current stage of the economic crisis of that system".

This process is very different from the kind of manifestos that come from small ideological groups. These are people engaged in very practical day-to-day struggle (the Barcelona dockworkers, the Deliveroo riders, to give just a few examples). Presumably the people involved consider a program like this from that vantage point - whether it will actually be useful as a tool to advance those day-to-day struggles, and to link those day-to-day struggles to the ultimate goal of libertarian communism.

I think that this description is pretty accurate: "it appears to be a series of reforms within the framework of capitalism that are hoped to be implemented by a mix of concessions extracted through organised struggle from employers and the state". The one thing I would emphasize is that this program is not directed to the state or political parties, asking them to do these things - it is directed towards the working class, as a guide to things which can be won through struggle.

FWIW, I think there's a material reason why those of us in the English-speaking world assume that these kind of programs are directed towards asking the state - it's because we're used to being irrelevant and marginal to working class struggles, we don't have any experience where a significant portion of the working class is actually expecting us to offer a program for action. That is beginning to not be the case in Spain.

It's not clear to me from the critical comments whether there is disagreement with some of the specific proposals, or with the idea altogether of putting forward a program like this. Some of the specific proposals may or may not have problems, any time where there's a bottom-up democratic process involving upwards of 100's of people it's likely that some of the results won't be perfect. However if the question is about whether or not any program at all should be put forward during a time of crisis, then I think it comes down to a question of whether there is anything to be won from fighting under capitalism or whether we should just have posters saying "full communism now" and leave the practical organizing to the nationalists/reformists.

This also comes down to the question of whether people believe in revolutionary working-class organizations on any level beyond a cadre group. If people think that these will be inherently reformist, OK, then they're going to think the CNT is reformist.

I do think it's funny that akai can consider the CNT vanguardist because they made a decision from the bottom-up that akai disagrees with. It seems like akai is still just upset that the CNT rejected the vanguard leadership of the old IWA that was trying to control their ability to make decisions like this.

Also funny is that the discussion about this on Facebook has mostly been tankies criticizing the CNT for attempting to provide a program that is an alternative to nationalism.

no1
Apr 30 2018 20:32

Spoken like a true politician

syndicalist
Apr 30 2018 20:55

@Oliver ---- I just found it to be an interesting read. Really not much else to say for or against. But I usually find programatic stuff interesting. And the CNT-AIT has regularly issued yearly programs since the days of coming out of the underground. They may have also done that during underground and exiled days as well, I don't really recall at the mo.

OliverTwister
Apr 30 2018 21:02
no1 wrote:
Spoken like a true politician

Do you have an actual critique or are you just a troll?

syndicalist
May 1 2018 00:01

BTW, I think smaller groups can constructively pen programs and manifestos that are reflective of their views and practical work. Personally, if folks continue to think in the cement head box of "big" and "small" or "big" versus small" it just is a nowhere argument. Over the years I've been part of small groups of worker militants or smaller organizations issuing shop oriented leaflets, workplace oriented newsletters and our approach has generally been principled, down to earth, reflective of both "here and now" stuff and non-rethorical (mostly) anarchy-syndicalsim as well.

I dunno, because someone sex they're a union doesn't always make it so. And cause others may say they're ideologically correct don't always make it so either.

Lugius
Apr 30 2018 23:51

I'd be interested to know how Oliver Twister and Ragnar reconcile the CNT being anarcho-syndicalist with suing the CNT-AIT in the Spanish courts.

Anarcho-syndicalism is a practice. One union suing another is an anathema to every principle of anarcho-syndicalist practice.

Last year? the IWW voted to support the initiative of the CNT to 're-found the IWA', the same CNT that is suing CNT-AIT. But then, one can't hold the IWW to anarcho-syndicalist standards as they are not anarcho-syndicalist - they say so themselves (see Myth#8 on their website).

But the FAU and USI claim to be. If anarcho-syndicalism can mean anything at all, including pursuing workers organisations through the courts, then it means nothing at all.

We never forget.

OliverTwister
May 1 2018 03:12
syndicalist wrote:
BTW, I think smaller groups can constructively pen programs and manifestos that are reflective of their views and practical work. Personally, if folks continue to think in the cement head box of "big" and "small" or "big" versus small" it just is a nowhere argument. Over the years I've been part of small groups of worker militants or smaller organizations issuing shop oriented leaflets, workplace oriented newsletters and our approach has generally been principled, down to earth, reflective of both "here and now" stuff and non-rethorical (mostly) anarchy-syndicalsim as well.

I dunno, because someone sex they're a union doesn't always make it so. And cause others may say they're ideologically correct don't always make it so either.

This is a good point. I guess I was thinking of a small group trying to make a manifesto for an entire country when they have no real roots in the struggle. It's very different at the level of shop leaflets or workplace newsletters.

However even at the level of a city, I think it's important to have real roots in the city before issuing a program or manifesto, vs. just being some militants located in the city whose primary practice is posting online.

@Lugius, at a certain point the entire IWA was supporting the CNT using the Spanish courts to defend its name against the split faction that became the CGT. If you want to denounce that, fine, but you'll have to denounce your entire political history going back to at least 28 years.

Maybe you do forget after all?

syndicalist
May 1 2018 03:59
Quote:
However even at the level of a city, I think it's important to have real roots in the city before issuing a program or manifesto, vs. just being some militants located in the city whose primary practice is posting online.

Not to digress from the OP. But I would say this is sorta yes and no. Years ago, when I first started out, there was no internet. So making contacts, communication etc was heavily face-to-face, open "lectures" (topical public presentations/discussions) and heavily on leaflets at demos etc etc. With today's methods of communication, using the internet as a form of communication, as form of electronic leafleting is helpful. And with many younger people, this is one way they might get started in a broader way. In-shop organizing, very different.My point is, part of the battle between some in the IWA and former Sections and beyond is either building up or belittling the size of others. OK, there are real differences, and those should be debated on merit, not "size matters" etc.

Anyway, my bad for digressing.

Lugius
May 1 2018 06:39

@olivertwister; nice try but there are not comparable as you well know. The court case 28 years ago was about the patrimony that the Spanish State owed to the CNT. The split faction of the CNT that became the CGT were reformists and it was they're actions that provoked the court case. Are you suggesting that the CNT just do nothing?

Did the IWW support the CGT in their court case? I ask because the IWW appears to be supporting the CNT against CNT-AIT. You've conveniently omitted the fact that the CNT initiated the court case against the CNT-AIT, not the other way around.

But, for the sake of an argument, let's agree with your contention that the CNT-AIT was at fault 28 years ago. Are you suggesting that it justifies the CNT's current legal action against the CNT-AIT?

The same CNT that claims to be 90% of the members. Bullying much? They're only demanding 500,000 euros.

That the IWW, the FAU and the USI (along with the rest of them) are tacitly supporting the CNT using the Spanish legal system against CNT-AIT. What an utter disgrace. It will take years of your best detergent to wash this stain out.

No, we won't forget.